1 00:00:07,500 --> 00:00:10,780 Tonight on Horizon, as part of BBC's sitcom season, 2 00:00:10,780 --> 00:00:13,380 the science of laughter. THEY LAUGH 3 00:00:13,380 --> 00:00:15,820 What is it? Why do we love it so much? 4 00:00:15,820 --> 00:00:17,820 And what has it got to do with comedy? 5 00:00:20,500 --> 00:00:22,740 But seeing as how the Horizon team aren't that funny 6 00:00:22,740 --> 00:00:26,580 in and of themselves, they've decided to hire a studio... 7 00:00:28,300 --> 00:00:29,460 ..round up an audience... 8 00:00:31,860 --> 00:00:33,500 ..and asked me to take charge. 9 00:00:36,620 --> 00:00:40,180 Horizon on laughter, like you've never seen it before. 10 00:00:40,180 --> 00:00:42,220 HE LAUGHS 11 00:00:51,540 --> 00:00:53,620 APPLAUSE 12 00:00:55,860 --> 00:00:57,420 Hello, everyone, I'm Jimmy Carr. 13 00:00:57,420 --> 00:00:59,900 In case you were wondering, this is still Horizon, 14 00:00:59,900 --> 00:01:03,020 the proper grown-up BBC science documentary series. 15 00:01:03,020 --> 00:01:04,940 Don't worry, I'll be on my best behaviour. 16 00:01:04,940 --> 00:01:08,220 There'll be none of my usual innuendo, because if this works out, 17 00:01:08,220 --> 00:01:10,460 I might get to meet Professor Brian Cox, 18 00:01:10,460 --> 00:01:12,700 and I can't tell you how much I love Cox. 19 00:01:12,700 --> 00:01:14,900 LAUGHTER 20 00:01:14,900 --> 00:01:16,140 Come on! 21 00:01:17,220 --> 00:01:18,540 So, I've got some great news - 22 00:01:18,540 --> 00:01:21,660 science has taken time out from giving your job to a robot, 23 00:01:21,660 --> 00:01:24,460 designing GM crops and cloning designer babies 24 00:01:24,460 --> 00:01:26,340 to investigate laughter. 25 00:01:26,340 --> 00:01:27,740 Rest assured, I'm not in charge. 26 00:01:27,740 --> 00:01:30,980 When it comes to the science stuff, we've called in the experts. 27 00:01:30,980 --> 00:01:33,420 We've got a group of eminent laughter scientists - 28 00:01:33,420 --> 00:01:35,260 yes, that is a real thing - 29 00:01:35,260 --> 00:01:37,460 and they're here, poised to enlighten. 30 00:01:37,460 --> 00:01:39,940 It's like Laboratoires Garnier back there. 31 00:01:39,940 --> 00:01:43,540 Hello, the scientists. ALL: Hi. 32 00:01:43,540 --> 00:01:46,020 We've also visited scientists who make people laugh 33 00:01:46,020 --> 00:01:47,740 and others who make animals laugh. 34 00:01:47,740 --> 00:01:49,860 We've caused pain, scanned brains 35 00:01:49,860 --> 00:01:52,380 and visited some of the least funny places on the planet, 36 00:01:52,380 --> 00:01:55,540 all in a bid to get to the bottom of laughter. 37 00:01:55,540 --> 00:01:58,540 And we've got a room full of unsuspecting volunteers, 38 00:01:58,540 --> 00:02:00,220 who think they're just an audience. 39 00:02:00,220 --> 00:02:02,420 AUDIENCE LAUGHS 40 00:02:02,420 --> 00:02:04,300 And that was nervous laughter. 41 00:02:04,300 --> 00:02:05,940 AUDIENCE LAUGHS LOUDLY 42 00:02:05,940 --> 00:02:09,740 EB White once said analysing comedy is like dissecting a frog - 43 00:02:09,740 --> 00:02:12,300 few people are interested and the frog dies. 44 00:02:13,820 --> 00:02:15,340 But what did he know? 45 00:02:15,340 --> 00:02:17,500 This is going to be the most fun science show 46 00:02:17,500 --> 00:02:19,540 since the one where they let Stephen Hawking use 47 00:02:19,540 --> 00:02:21,500 the Large Hadron Collider as a water slide. 48 00:02:21,500 --> 00:02:24,180 LAUGHTER Right, let's crack on. 49 00:02:24,180 --> 00:02:26,580 Probably a good idea to start with some classic jokes. 50 00:02:35,980 --> 00:02:37,220 Two monkeys in a bath. 51 00:02:37,220 --> 00:02:40,340 One says to the other, "Ooh-ooh-ooh, ah-ah-ah." 52 00:02:40,340 --> 00:02:42,380 The other says, "Well, put the cold tap on, then." 53 00:02:44,100 --> 00:02:45,500 How do you make a cat go woof? 54 00:02:46,540 --> 00:02:48,140 Pour petrol on it and light it. 55 00:02:54,260 --> 00:02:55,900 These are the clean ones. 56 00:02:57,300 --> 00:03:00,780 I was walking with my wife when I saw six men kicking and punching 57 00:03:00,780 --> 00:03:03,820 my mother-in-law. My wife said, "Aren't you going to help?" 58 00:03:03,820 --> 00:03:05,340 I said, "No, six should be enough." 59 00:03:07,860 --> 00:03:10,340 A policeman came to my front door and said, 60 00:03:10,340 --> 00:03:13,300 "I'm sorry, sir, but it looks like your wife's been in an accident." 61 00:03:13,300 --> 00:03:15,940 I said, "I know, but she's got a cracking personality." 62 00:03:17,820 --> 00:03:21,100 Now, here's a question you never hear a stand-up comedian ask. 63 00:03:21,100 --> 00:03:23,100 Why did you laugh at those jokes? 64 00:03:23,100 --> 00:03:25,540 Does anyone have any ideas on why they laughed? 65 00:03:25,540 --> 00:03:26,540 I hate cats. 66 00:03:28,180 --> 00:03:30,420 "I hate cats" is a very good answer. 67 00:03:30,420 --> 00:03:32,060 I'm sure that's not the case, though, 68 00:03:32,060 --> 00:03:34,060 that's just another joke on top of that one, so... 69 00:03:34,060 --> 00:03:36,700 Any ideas on why you laughed? Nostalgia. Because it's funny. 70 00:03:36,700 --> 00:03:38,300 Nostalgia is a very good one, yeah, 71 00:03:38,300 --> 00:03:40,580 cos they're old classic school jokes, 72 00:03:40,580 --> 00:03:41,980 and the familiarity of that. 73 00:03:41,980 --> 00:03:45,820 That is kind of a...that's a reason sometimes. Any other... 74 00:03:45,820 --> 00:03:48,860 thoughts? Breaking the ice? 75 00:03:48,860 --> 00:03:50,940 Well, I suppose it is, yeah, that social activity. 76 00:03:50,940 --> 00:03:53,660 I think we're going to talk about that later on - that idea that 77 00:03:53,660 --> 00:03:56,180 laughter as a kind of group activity. 78 00:03:56,180 --> 00:03:58,020 Don't panic, we're going to explain all this. 79 00:03:59,060 --> 00:04:01,860 This is Horizon, so let's throw some science at the problem. 80 00:04:05,740 --> 00:04:07,180 University College London... 81 00:04:08,620 --> 00:04:10,820 ..boasting impressive neoclassical architecture 82 00:04:10,820 --> 00:04:12,700 and a solid academic heritage. 83 00:04:14,500 --> 00:04:17,100 And, more recently, it's gained a reputation as somewhere 84 00:04:17,100 --> 00:04:20,300 where laughter is taken very seriously indeed. 85 00:04:21,420 --> 00:04:23,060 THEY LAUGH 86 00:04:23,060 --> 00:04:25,380 Today, Professor Sophie Scott... 87 00:04:26,900 --> 00:04:29,500 ..is gathering raw material for her research. 88 00:04:30,740 --> 00:04:34,020 What we're just going to do is go through some videos 89 00:04:34,020 --> 00:04:38,660 and just really find some stuff that makes you laugh, OK? OK. 90 00:04:38,660 --> 00:04:41,700 Cos the point of this is, I don't really care what it is, 91 00:04:41,700 --> 00:04:44,340 I'd just like to collect some really nice laughter from you. 92 00:04:46,020 --> 00:04:48,020 And to ensure a perfect recording... 93 00:04:50,060 --> 00:04:53,060 ..she's using UCL's anechoic chamber. 94 00:04:53,060 --> 00:04:54,940 It just means no echo. 95 00:04:54,940 --> 00:04:57,380 What we're doing here is we're recording somebody 96 00:04:57,380 --> 00:04:58,580 laughing spontaneously. 97 00:04:59,620 --> 00:05:00,820 Get nice and comfortable. 98 00:05:02,060 --> 00:05:05,060 So, I'm playing her something, which we're both fairly confident 99 00:05:05,060 --> 00:05:07,300 is going to make her laugh. 100 00:05:07,300 --> 00:05:08,900 VOLUNTEER LAUGHS 101 00:05:08,900 --> 00:05:11,540 I just got really interested that everything done on emotions 102 00:05:11,540 --> 00:05:14,220 is negative, and it turned out that the psychologist Paul Ekman 103 00:05:14,220 --> 00:05:17,700 had suggested that there might well be positive emotions, 104 00:05:17,700 --> 00:05:19,700 which might actually be basic emotions. 105 00:05:19,700 --> 00:05:22,220 And in fact he'd said they may well be primarily conveyed 106 00:05:22,220 --> 00:05:25,460 with the voice, so I thought, "Brilliant, that's what I do". 107 00:05:25,460 --> 00:05:29,660 Sophie discovered that laughter is something all humans understand, 108 00:05:29,660 --> 00:05:32,300 regardless of location, culture or language. 109 00:05:32,300 --> 00:05:33,820 VOLUNTEER LAUGHS 110 00:05:33,820 --> 00:05:37,980 I think it's really important to study laughter because first of all, 111 00:05:37,980 --> 00:05:40,020 it's a basic expression of emotion. 112 00:05:40,020 --> 00:05:41,700 It's a non-verbal expression of emotion, 113 00:05:41,700 --> 00:05:44,180 but it's one we drop into all the time. 114 00:05:44,180 --> 00:05:47,100 VOLUNTEER LAUGHS LOUDLY 115 00:05:47,100 --> 00:05:50,580 We drop into this old mammal vocal behaviour, 116 00:05:50,580 --> 00:05:53,900 to do a lot of the emotional work of an interaction. 117 00:05:53,900 --> 00:05:56,260 VOLUNTEER LAUGHS 118 00:05:57,700 --> 00:06:00,740 Right, I found a really nice bit of laughter and then I lost it again, 119 00:06:00,740 --> 00:06:01,940 so that's what I'm trying to do. 120 00:06:01,940 --> 00:06:03,740 VOLUNTEER LAUGHTER CONTINUES 121 00:06:03,740 --> 00:06:06,100 There we go. Wasn't that lovely? 122 00:06:08,260 --> 00:06:10,420 I realise that being delighted by a spectrogram 123 00:06:10,420 --> 00:06:12,100 is sort of niche interest. 124 00:06:16,940 --> 00:06:19,820 Well, fascinating stuff. And she's here to talk about her research. 125 00:06:19,820 --> 00:06:22,140 Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to the studio 126 00:06:22,140 --> 00:06:24,700 Professor Sophie Scott. 127 00:06:26,740 --> 00:06:29,900 Hello. Proper science. Proper science. 128 00:06:29,900 --> 00:06:32,500 Hello, Professor Sophie Scott, how are you? I'm fine, thank you. 129 00:06:32,500 --> 00:06:35,860 OK, so, you're saying everyone laughs? 130 00:06:35,860 --> 00:06:37,100 As far as we can tell, 131 00:06:37,100 --> 00:06:39,340 when we have done some cross-cultural work on this, 132 00:06:39,340 --> 00:06:41,780 wherever you go in the world, people recognise laughter. 133 00:06:41,780 --> 00:06:44,620 Even if you go to a culture where people might not laugh in public, 134 00:06:44,620 --> 00:06:46,940 cos maybe it's rude, they still recognise laughter, 135 00:06:46,940 --> 00:06:48,660 and they will still do it in some places. 136 00:06:48,660 --> 00:06:51,300 Even like Inverness on a bank holiday Monday? Potentially! 137 00:06:51,300 --> 00:06:53,980 Technically, I should be able to get laughs out of those people, 138 00:06:53,980 --> 00:06:56,580 even if, in reality, not the case. 139 00:06:56,580 --> 00:06:58,620 They might know it when they saw it happening, 140 00:06:58,620 --> 00:07:01,260 if you made someone else laugh, they might know what's going on. 141 00:07:01,260 --> 00:07:03,460 You're saying it's a universal across humanity? 142 00:07:03,460 --> 00:07:05,260 We don't have the same sense of humour, 143 00:07:05,260 --> 00:07:06,860 but we all recognise laughter? Exactly. 144 00:07:06,860 --> 00:07:09,380 Humour can be very, very widely varying 145 00:07:09,380 --> 00:07:11,500 across different times and places. 146 00:07:11,500 --> 00:07:14,300 Laughter, as a behaviour, stayed pretty constant. 147 00:07:14,300 --> 00:07:17,100 OK, can we demonstrate this? Yes. We've got an example of somebody 148 00:07:17,100 --> 00:07:19,620 producing some positive expressions of emotion from... 149 00:07:19,620 --> 00:07:21,220 He's from the Himba tribe in Namibia. 150 00:07:24,020 --> 00:07:26,020 Hi, hi-hi! 151 00:07:26,020 --> 00:07:27,500 Hi-hi! 152 00:07:27,500 --> 00:07:29,300 Hi, hi, hi... 153 00:07:30,500 --> 00:07:32,140 Any guesses? 154 00:07:32,140 --> 00:07:35,580 Obviously, if you're watching in Namibia... I mean... 155 00:07:35,580 --> 00:07:37,620 Couldn't be more bloody obvious, could it? 156 00:07:37,620 --> 00:07:40,140 Any idea what emotion that was? 157 00:07:40,140 --> 00:07:42,180 It looked to me like he was clapping backwards. 158 00:07:43,540 --> 00:07:45,420 Cos it was kind of... It was a weird kind of... 159 00:07:45,420 --> 00:07:47,460 So, what he was doing is expressing triumph. 160 00:07:47,460 --> 00:07:50,540 So, the sort of... Imagine that you all really like football 161 00:07:50,540 --> 00:07:53,060 and the football team that you like has just scored a goal. 162 00:07:53,060 --> 00:07:54,500 Make the sound. AUDIENCE CHEER 163 00:07:54,500 --> 00:07:56,500 So, that's what you tend to find in the UK, 164 00:07:56,500 --> 00:07:59,660 people making a triumphant noise sensibly, so like a whoo sound. 165 00:07:59,660 --> 00:08:01,580 And that's not the noise the Himba make, 166 00:08:01,580 --> 00:08:03,820 and it's not cross-culturally recognised. 167 00:08:03,820 --> 00:08:05,860 Let's have another look at this guy. 168 00:08:05,860 --> 00:08:08,900 Hi, hi-hi! HE LAUGHS 169 00:08:08,900 --> 00:08:11,140 AUDIENCE LAUGHS 170 00:08:12,220 --> 00:08:14,580 OK, so at the end there, did we all get what was he doing? 171 00:08:14,580 --> 00:08:16,220 Yeah. 172 00:08:16,220 --> 00:08:17,500 So, that's uni... 173 00:08:17,500 --> 00:08:20,060 That's in every culture around the world, the laugh is... 174 00:08:20,060 --> 00:08:21,780 You'd be able to tell someone was laughing? 175 00:08:21,780 --> 00:08:23,540 Yes, you would know what was happening. 176 00:08:23,540 --> 00:08:26,300 The idea with basic expressions of emotion is that they reflect 177 00:08:26,300 --> 00:08:28,700 something about our evolutionary history, we share them 178 00:08:28,700 --> 00:08:31,820 with other mammals. Things like fear, anger, disgust, sadness. 179 00:08:31,820 --> 00:08:33,540 You find those in other mammals. 180 00:08:33,540 --> 00:08:36,620 So, anger in a dog's face isn't that different from anger 181 00:08:36,620 --> 00:08:37,780 in a human face. 182 00:08:39,180 --> 00:08:41,580 It's possible that we need to add laughter 183 00:08:41,580 --> 00:08:43,980 to this set of basic emotions. 184 00:08:43,980 --> 00:08:46,860 Right. So, not everyone laughs at the same things, obviously, 185 00:08:46,860 --> 00:08:49,660 we all have a different sense of humour. Take a look. 186 00:09:00,300 --> 00:09:02,940 Americans don't tend to really know that much about the world, 187 00:09:02,940 --> 00:09:04,700 so they don't get other people so much. 188 00:09:04,700 --> 00:09:08,620 At the moment, the in-thing is about quail birds. 189 00:09:08,620 --> 00:09:11,460 Just someone that's a grown man, maybe acting like a child. 190 00:09:12,500 --> 00:09:15,300 Excuse me. Too much gas. 191 00:09:15,300 --> 00:09:20,820 Armenians are famous for having a good sense of humour, and... 192 00:09:20,820 --> 00:09:21,820 Yeah. 193 00:09:23,260 --> 00:09:27,460 Got a new car. They say she's probably got a quail farm. 194 00:09:27,460 --> 00:09:29,940 What makes me laugh is cheeky banter. 195 00:09:29,940 --> 00:09:33,020 Squirrels, cats, ravens eating chips. 196 00:09:33,020 --> 00:09:36,740 I think the British humour is so sharp and so cutting. 197 00:09:36,740 --> 00:09:39,660 Do you want to hear a joke about helium? Hee-hee-hee. 198 00:09:39,660 --> 00:09:42,260 Our satire is more like a gentle satire. 199 00:09:42,260 --> 00:09:46,100 In the Philippines, we make fun of dumb people. 200 00:09:46,100 --> 00:09:50,020 It's like trying to explain what makes a man's heart beat 201 00:09:50,020 --> 00:09:53,540 when he sees a blue-eyed blonde with amazing jugs. 202 00:09:53,540 --> 00:09:56,180 If you're looking good, you've probably... 203 00:09:56,180 --> 00:10:00,220 Got a few quail birds...in your purse! 204 00:10:00,220 --> 00:10:03,660 British people are famous for self-laughing. 205 00:10:03,660 --> 00:10:05,260 Jimmy Carr's one-liners. 206 00:10:05,260 --> 00:10:07,300 He's my favourite comedian I know of. 207 00:10:07,300 --> 00:10:10,140 "We in America, we wash hands." 208 00:10:10,140 --> 00:10:12,220 And the attendant guy turns to him and says, 209 00:10:12,220 --> 00:10:14,860 "You know we in Lithuania, we don't pee on our hands." 210 00:10:14,860 --> 00:10:16,380 What do you do with a dead chemist? 211 00:10:16,380 --> 00:10:17,460 You barium. 212 00:10:17,460 --> 00:10:19,500 And you end up wanting to look like a quail 213 00:10:19,500 --> 00:10:21,340 because you're worth a lot of money. 214 00:10:22,540 --> 00:10:27,260 So, it's a pain au chocolat meeting a croissant and he's asking, 215 00:10:27,260 --> 00:10:30,380 "Why are you so weird? Why do you have a moon shape?" 216 00:10:30,380 --> 00:10:33,260 And the other one says, "What are you talking about? 217 00:10:33,260 --> 00:10:36,780 "Because you have, like, shit all over your ass." 218 00:10:38,220 --> 00:10:40,660 SHE SPEAKS FRENCH 219 00:10:48,900 --> 00:10:51,780 So, laughter is universal but what we laugh at 220 00:10:51,780 --> 00:10:53,380 is cultural and personal. 221 00:10:53,380 --> 00:10:56,500 Sophie, everyone does it, everyone understands what it means, 222 00:10:56,500 --> 00:10:58,300 but what actually is laughter? 223 00:10:58,300 --> 00:11:00,420 Laughter's more like a different way of breathing 224 00:11:00,420 --> 00:11:02,980 than it as anything else. So, what we are all doing right now, 225 00:11:02,980 --> 00:11:05,420 hopefully, is using the intercostal muscles, 226 00:11:05,420 --> 00:11:08,260 the muscles between our ribs, to get air in and out of our bodies. 227 00:11:08,260 --> 00:11:09,980 It's called metabolic breathing. Exactly. 228 00:11:09,980 --> 00:11:11,540 You breathe in, you breathe out. 229 00:11:11,540 --> 00:11:13,900 Air's being drawn in and then squeezed back out again. 230 00:11:13,900 --> 00:11:16,580 I'm good at this. So, were I to look at your chest wall moving... 231 00:11:16,580 --> 00:11:18,420 Well, that feels weird. 232 00:11:18,420 --> 00:11:20,820 I've over-thought it. 233 00:11:20,820 --> 00:11:23,780 Go on. My chest wall is moving in and out... You keep going with that. 234 00:11:23,780 --> 00:11:26,940 You'd see this almost sinusoidal movement, this very smooth movement. 235 00:11:26,940 --> 00:11:28,580 You start doing it the minute you're born, 236 00:11:28,580 --> 00:11:30,180 that's it the whole rest of your life. 237 00:11:30,180 --> 00:11:33,020 When we start laughing, those same muscles start to contract. 238 00:11:33,260 --> 00:11:37,100 They're really large deflections, just squeezing air out of you, 239 00:11:37,100 --> 00:11:39,420 and that's basically all laughter is. 240 00:11:39,420 --> 00:11:41,580 It's an extremely primitive way of making a sound. 241 00:11:41,580 --> 00:11:44,820 Ultimately, if you couldn't stop laughing, it'd kill you. 242 00:11:44,820 --> 00:11:47,460 Yeah. Basically, I'm a deadly weapon, is what you're saying. 243 00:11:47,460 --> 00:11:49,900 You definitely are. It's just squeezing air out of you, 244 00:11:49,900 --> 00:11:52,740 it stops you breathing, it stops you talking, it's trying to kill you. 245 00:11:52,740 --> 00:11:55,380 And we've rigged some people up, so we can show this. Exactly. 246 00:11:55,380 --> 00:11:58,260 And what we'll notice is, hopefully, if you can make them laugh, 247 00:11:58,260 --> 00:12:00,940 that both the very fine movement you get during talking 248 00:12:00,940 --> 00:12:04,100 and the smooth movement that you get during breathing, should go away. 249 00:12:04,100 --> 00:12:06,580 And instead, what we get is just these big zigzags 250 00:12:06,580 --> 00:12:08,580 as air's just being squeezed out of you. 251 00:12:08,580 --> 00:12:10,780 OK, so, are we looking at them breathing first? 252 00:12:10,780 --> 00:12:12,740 Well, hopefully they're already breathing. 253 00:12:12,740 --> 00:12:14,500 OK, so are they breathing? Hopefully! 254 00:12:14,500 --> 00:12:17,420 I can see them breathing. They're breathing now and you're happy? 255 00:12:17,420 --> 00:12:20,540 Sinead, your PhD assistant... Hi, Sinead. How are you? 256 00:12:20,540 --> 00:12:23,220 So, you're saying those two ladies are alive? 257 00:12:23,220 --> 00:12:25,300 Fantastic. This is incredible science. 258 00:12:26,620 --> 00:12:29,140 So, I've got to try and make them laugh now? Please. 259 00:12:29,140 --> 00:12:30,740 Right, I'll do some jokes from over here. 260 00:12:30,740 --> 00:12:33,060 We've got a performance area with... Yay, everyone. 261 00:12:33,060 --> 00:12:36,020 AUDIENCE: Yay! OK. 262 00:12:36,020 --> 00:12:39,900 I look like this, obviously, because my dad is Irish and my mum is... 263 00:12:39,900 --> 00:12:41,420 Roger Federer. 264 00:12:41,420 --> 00:12:43,580 LAUGHTER 265 00:12:43,580 --> 00:12:46,380 I feel like you're laughing at me, not with me, there. 266 00:12:46,380 --> 00:12:50,220 A nurse finds a rectal thermometer in her pocket and thinks, 267 00:12:50,220 --> 00:12:51,900 "Some arsehole's got my pen." 268 00:12:54,980 --> 00:12:56,940 I got talking to a North African girl recently 269 00:12:56,940 --> 00:12:58,540 in her native language, for hours. 270 00:12:58,540 --> 00:13:00,580 We just...clicked. 271 00:13:03,580 --> 00:13:04,820 That's enough of that. 272 00:13:04,820 --> 00:13:07,140 We should be able to see some sort of difference then, so... 273 00:13:07,140 --> 00:13:09,300 Did you see anything there? Oh. Oh, look at that. 274 00:13:09,300 --> 00:13:11,380 Can you see at the bottom there, she's breathing, 275 00:13:11,380 --> 00:13:14,300 and then you're really making her laugh. Can you see the big zigzags? 276 00:13:14,300 --> 00:13:17,060 Then breath, breath, breath and then zigzags again. Hang on, 277 00:13:17,060 --> 00:13:18,860 I'm going over to have a look. I'm going to use 278 00:13:18,860 --> 00:13:21,340 one of these technical fingers. So, that was the laugh? 279 00:13:21,340 --> 00:13:23,540 Yes, that's the laugh there. That's a pretty big laugh. 280 00:13:23,540 --> 00:13:25,460 That's pretty big, and there's a big... 281 00:13:25,460 --> 00:13:28,180 If you look at the top as well, the person at the top is also laughing. 282 00:13:28,180 --> 00:13:30,540 Yeah, but she wasn't really into it. LAUGHTER 283 00:13:30,540 --> 00:13:32,660 You were funny earlier. It feels like, if I was... 284 00:13:32,660 --> 00:13:34,460 If I'm going to work as an assassin, 285 00:13:34,460 --> 00:13:37,380 and that is ultimately the goal of this show, 286 00:13:37,380 --> 00:13:41,500 I would not be able to kill the lady in the yellow, 287 00:13:41,500 --> 00:13:44,260 but the lady in the orange, I think... 288 00:13:44,260 --> 00:13:46,620 Yeah. You better watch yourself, love. 289 00:13:46,620 --> 00:13:48,420 OK, so, supplemental to that, 290 00:13:48,420 --> 00:13:51,580 if you were to make someone laugh uncontrollably, 291 00:13:51,580 --> 00:13:53,620 could it be a dangerous thing? Well, it can be. 292 00:13:53,620 --> 00:13:56,340 I mean, it literally is stopping you from breathing. 293 00:13:56,340 --> 00:13:57,780 It's just squeezing air out of you 294 00:13:57,780 --> 00:13:59,700 and it's stopping you doing anything else. 295 00:13:59,700 --> 00:14:01,340 And there's even a postural reflex 296 00:14:01,340 --> 00:14:03,340 that means that we're all sitting in our chairs, 297 00:14:03,340 --> 00:14:04,980 we don't just slump to the ground. 298 00:14:04,980 --> 00:14:06,620 So even when your muscles aren't working, 299 00:14:06,620 --> 00:14:09,060 they're holding you in place, and that is suppressed 300 00:14:09,060 --> 00:14:11,620 when you start laughing. That's why you become weak and floppy 301 00:14:11,620 --> 00:14:14,140 when you're laughing, and that, inevitably, at some point 302 00:14:14,140 --> 00:14:16,460 you can become helpless with laughter, at which point, 303 00:14:16,460 --> 00:14:18,980 if a tiger came in or something, there would be a brief window 304 00:14:18,980 --> 00:14:20,940 when you wouldn't be able to do much about it. 305 00:14:20,940 --> 00:14:22,940 Well, my mother, weirdly, had a very odd laugh. 306 00:14:22,940 --> 00:14:25,180 She had a laugh where she made no noise at all 307 00:14:25,180 --> 00:14:26,740 and lost muscular control. Right. 308 00:14:26,740 --> 00:14:28,740 So she would just literally, kind of... 309 00:14:28,740 --> 00:14:31,580 And then, with her last bit of energy she would go, 310 00:14:31,580 --> 00:14:35,340 "Stop, just stop," and obviously you would never stop. 311 00:14:35,340 --> 00:14:38,260 I got into doing this for a living, 312 00:14:38,260 --> 00:14:40,300 because it was the most fun thing in the world to... 313 00:14:41,620 --> 00:14:44,060 Oh, my mum has melted. Genius. 314 00:14:44,060 --> 00:14:47,220 So, laughter's different, physiologically, to normal speech. 315 00:14:47,220 --> 00:14:50,700 If you couldn't stop laughing, it could genuinely harm you. 316 00:14:50,700 --> 00:14:52,300 I believe we have some MRI scans. 317 00:14:52,300 --> 00:14:54,780 We do. We're going to start... Excellent. 318 00:14:54,780 --> 00:14:57,700 Science in... I'm sorry, I didn't have time to get to the doctor's, 319 00:14:57,700 --> 00:14:59,700 so we're going to quickly go through these now, 320 00:14:59,700 --> 00:15:01,980 see if I'm going to make it. So, what are we looking at? 321 00:15:01,980 --> 00:15:03,780 What we're looking at first is... 322 00:15:03,780 --> 00:15:06,340 We're running the MRI machine like a video camera, 323 00:15:06,340 --> 00:15:09,540 so you're literally taking a movie of somebody speaking here. 324 00:15:09,540 --> 00:15:12,940 What she's doing is she is talking her way through some nursery rhymes 325 00:15:12,940 --> 00:15:15,660 and you can see everything that's happening during speech - 326 00:15:15,660 --> 00:15:17,260 very complex movements of the tongue, 327 00:15:17,260 --> 00:15:19,940 you've got the jaw moving up and down, the lips, the soft palate, 328 00:15:19,940 --> 00:15:22,060 the bit at the back of your nose, the larynx, 329 00:15:22,060 --> 00:15:23,580 the voice box is moving up and down. 330 00:15:23,580 --> 00:15:24,820 So, that's speech - 331 00:15:24,820 --> 00:15:27,620 very complex, nothing like that out there in nature. 332 00:15:27,620 --> 00:15:29,500 And then if we move on to the next one, 333 00:15:29,500 --> 00:15:32,300 which should be somebody laughing. It's the same person laughing. 334 00:15:32,300 --> 00:15:33,980 We made her laugh in the scanner, 335 00:15:33,980 --> 00:15:36,460 and if you look, none of that is happening, basically. 336 00:15:36,460 --> 00:15:39,220 She's moving up and down a lot cos her ribcage is moving. 337 00:15:39,220 --> 00:15:41,900 The tongue is staying in the bottom of the mouth, 338 00:15:41,900 --> 00:15:45,500 and if you've ever laughed until the back of your throat hurts, 339 00:15:45,500 --> 00:15:47,780 you can see why that's happening there, cos actually 340 00:15:47,780 --> 00:15:49,980 you can see she's squeezing the tongue right back up 341 00:15:49,980 --> 00:15:51,180 against the pharynx, 342 00:15:51,180 --> 00:15:54,260 so you're squeezing all that air out through an even narrower pipe. 343 00:15:54,260 --> 00:15:56,900 I'm sorry, what did you nail her to, to get this to happen? 344 00:15:58,140 --> 00:16:01,540 Who doesn't move their head even slightly when they laugh? 345 00:16:01,540 --> 00:16:04,220 She's in something that looks disturbingly like 346 00:16:04,220 --> 00:16:05,940 a kind of sarcophagus. 347 00:16:05,940 --> 00:16:09,500 She's in something that's holding her head and shoulders in position 348 00:16:09,500 --> 00:16:12,740 so we can image all this bit here. Where is she now? 349 00:16:12,740 --> 00:16:15,980 She's alive, she's well, she escaped, she made it through. 350 00:16:18,020 --> 00:16:20,220 She escaped? LAUGHTER 351 00:16:20,220 --> 00:16:22,900 OK, so laughter is more like an animal call than speaking - 352 00:16:22,900 --> 00:16:24,940 primal and contagious. OK, I get that. 353 00:16:24,940 --> 00:16:28,300 So, that's what laughter is, but what exactly is it for? 354 00:16:28,300 --> 00:16:30,420 Well, thankfully, one scientist has taken time off 355 00:16:30,420 --> 00:16:32,460 from developing jet boots, to find out. 356 00:16:38,140 --> 00:16:40,980 Oxford University boasts some of the prettiest academic buildings 357 00:16:40,980 --> 00:16:41,980 in the world. 358 00:16:43,180 --> 00:16:45,980 These grand palaces of learning are largely the preserve 359 00:16:45,980 --> 00:16:47,700 of the humanities. 360 00:16:47,700 --> 00:16:51,140 But because Professor Robin Dunbar is a scientist, 361 00:16:51,140 --> 00:16:52,340 he's forced to work here... 362 00:16:55,420 --> 00:16:57,420 ..in this architectural abomination. 363 00:16:59,060 --> 00:17:02,020 Out of the sight of tourists and university website photographers. 364 00:17:03,820 --> 00:17:06,780 Here, geographically and aesthetically isolated, 365 00:17:06,780 --> 00:17:09,020 Dunbar causes people pain. 366 00:17:12,460 --> 00:17:15,500 Because he claims it throws light on why we laugh. 367 00:17:19,380 --> 00:17:23,060 So, what we're doing here is we're looking to see whether 368 00:17:23,060 --> 00:17:27,500 pain threshold increases after you've laughed. 369 00:17:27,500 --> 00:17:29,740 First, the baseline measurement. 370 00:17:29,740 --> 00:17:30,940 OK. Now! 371 00:17:41,500 --> 00:17:42,540 Stop. 372 00:17:45,780 --> 00:17:46,780 Stop. 373 00:17:54,020 --> 00:17:55,700 We have a winner. 374 00:17:55,700 --> 00:17:56,540 Stop. 375 00:17:56,540 --> 00:17:57,700 Good work. 376 00:17:58,580 --> 00:18:00,380 And now the fun part. 377 00:18:23,180 --> 00:18:25,980 Professor Dunbar is an experimental psychologist 378 00:18:25,980 --> 00:18:28,420 and an evolutionary biologist... 379 00:18:29,660 --> 00:18:31,260 ..which is quite a mouthful. 380 00:18:31,260 --> 00:18:34,140 But what it means is he's able to both formulate ideas 381 00:18:34,140 --> 00:18:37,700 about our species development and also test them in a lab. 382 00:18:39,300 --> 00:18:41,620 And one of his main ideas is about grooming. 383 00:18:44,820 --> 00:18:48,180 Monkeys and apes create their friendships, 384 00:18:48,180 --> 00:18:52,020 their relationships with each other and thereby bond their social groups 385 00:18:52,020 --> 00:18:55,340 by grooming, social grooming - grooming each other. 386 00:18:55,340 --> 00:18:57,700 It turns out that that light stroking 387 00:18:57,700 --> 00:19:00,340 triggers an endorphin response in the brain. 388 00:19:02,180 --> 00:19:06,260 The problem with grooming is it's a one-on-one activity - 389 00:19:06,260 --> 00:19:08,460 you can only groom one individual at a time. 390 00:19:08,460 --> 00:19:10,500 So, the problem is how to sort of groom 391 00:19:10,500 --> 00:19:12,140 with several people simultaneously. 392 00:19:17,060 --> 00:19:20,860 Robin's theory holds that laughter is effectively remote tickling, 393 00:19:20,860 --> 00:19:22,500 producing the same chemical high. 394 00:19:29,380 --> 00:19:31,820 And if he's right, the laughing volunteers in the lab 395 00:19:31,820 --> 00:19:34,820 will now be flushed with pain-beating endorphins... 396 00:19:36,140 --> 00:19:38,100 ..and they'll beat their previous times 397 00:19:38,100 --> 00:19:39,700 in the wall-sit test. 398 00:19:40,820 --> 00:19:41,980 OK? 399 00:19:43,980 --> 00:19:45,020 Go. 400 00:19:59,460 --> 00:20:00,580 Stop. 401 00:20:02,780 --> 00:20:04,460 Stop. 402 00:20:11,260 --> 00:20:12,740 Stop. 403 00:20:16,100 --> 00:20:17,300 Stop. 404 00:20:25,220 --> 00:20:28,380 It's direct evidence that laughter does produce endorphins. 405 00:20:30,300 --> 00:20:34,340 Yes, you'd normally expect something between, on average, I don't know, 406 00:20:34,340 --> 00:20:39,780 about five seconds and anything up to 20 seconds increase in time, 407 00:20:39,780 --> 00:20:41,900 and that's pretty much what we have here. 408 00:20:41,900 --> 00:20:43,580 All statistically significant. 409 00:20:47,780 --> 00:20:51,660 So, laughter can help you get through a painful experience, 410 00:20:51,660 --> 00:20:54,500 which is why you hear so much of it at my shows. 411 00:20:54,500 --> 00:20:56,740 Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome my next guest, 412 00:20:56,740 --> 00:20:58,660 evil genius, Professor Robin Dunbar. 413 00:21:04,300 --> 00:21:06,260 Thanks so much for coming. Take a seat. 414 00:21:06,260 --> 00:21:08,300 Hi. Now, you know Sophie, right? Yep. 415 00:21:08,300 --> 00:21:10,340 Of course, all scientists know each other. 416 00:21:10,340 --> 00:21:11,940 We do, it's a small community. 417 00:21:11,940 --> 00:21:15,140 So, how did grooming begat laughter? 418 00:21:16,220 --> 00:21:21,060 Well, essentially, the real problem is that we needed to 419 00:21:21,060 --> 00:21:24,540 be able to groom, if you like, with more individuals simultaneously 420 00:21:24,540 --> 00:21:26,380 in order to be able to have much bigger groups 421 00:21:26,380 --> 00:21:28,100 than is typical of monkeys and apes. 422 00:21:28,100 --> 00:21:32,260 So, how many in a typical group of monkeys and apes? 423 00:21:32,260 --> 00:21:35,540 The most social species, baboons, chimpanzees, something like that, 424 00:21:35,540 --> 00:21:37,740 about 50 is the typical group size. 425 00:21:37,740 --> 00:21:40,020 And what do they call that, Professor Dunbar? 426 00:21:40,020 --> 00:21:42,620 Is it called the Dunbar Number? Ah. 427 00:21:42,620 --> 00:21:43,860 What's the Dunbar Number? 428 00:21:43,860 --> 00:21:46,660 Cos you went ahead and named something after yourself... 429 00:21:46,660 --> 00:21:48,300 LAUGHTER 430 00:21:48,300 --> 00:21:50,780 ..which is, I mean, ego-wise, pretty terrific. 431 00:21:50,780 --> 00:21:52,980 Do they pay you money to say these things? They do, yeah. 432 00:21:54,820 --> 00:21:57,020 No, Dunbar's Number is technically 433 00:21:57,020 --> 00:21:59,460 the number of the size of human groups, 434 00:21:59,460 --> 00:22:04,180 or the number of friends and family that you have, and that's 150, 435 00:22:04,180 --> 00:22:08,820 that's three times bigger than the kind of typical biggest groups 436 00:22:08,820 --> 00:22:10,860 you get in monkeys and apes. 437 00:22:10,860 --> 00:22:13,700 So, that's because they can individually groom 438 00:22:13,700 --> 00:22:16,300 other monkeys and apes up to about 50, 439 00:22:16,300 --> 00:22:18,540 and then they break off and start another group. 440 00:22:18,540 --> 00:22:20,620 Essentially, that's what ends up happening, 441 00:22:20,620 --> 00:22:23,860 because if you don't bond with the individuals 442 00:22:23,860 --> 00:22:29,340 you are part of the group with, the group will gradually split up and... 443 00:22:30,700 --> 00:22:33,300 ..into two separate groups, and that happens with us. 444 00:22:33,300 --> 00:22:36,860 I mean, if we don't engage constantly with our friends 445 00:22:36,860 --> 00:22:38,860 and relations and so on, 446 00:22:38,860 --> 00:22:42,420 gradually those relationships just die quietly away. 447 00:22:42,420 --> 00:22:44,980 So we have to keep this, kind of what's effectively 448 00:22:44,980 --> 00:22:47,420 a form of grooming, going. 449 00:22:47,420 --> 00:22:52,540 And we do it by grooming in the way that monkeys and apes do - 450 00:22:52,540 --> 00:22:55,940 with the patting and the touch on the shoulder and the cuddling 451 00:22:55,940 --> 00:22:57,180 and all that kind of stuff. 452 00:22:57,180 --> 00:22:59,980 We do all that but it's a one-on-one thing 453 00:22:59,980 --> 00:23:03,260 and you can't do it with more than one person at once. 454 00:23:03,260 --> 00:23:05,700 Oh, you can. HE LAUGHS 455 00:23:05,700 --> 00:23:08,220 Welcome to showbusiness, Professor Dunbar. 456 00:23:08,220 --> 00:23:09,780 But no, I take your point there. 457 00:23:09,780 --> 00:23:14,260 So the idea of remote tickling, I find very pleasing. The idea that... 458 00:23:14,260 --> 00:23:17,300 I've kind of, I like to think of myself as a drug dealer, 459 00:23:17,300 --> 00:23:19,300 but the drug that I'm dealing is endorphins, 460 00:23:19,300 --> 00:23:21,100 and you've already got the drugs on you 461 00:23:21,100 --> 00:23:23,980 and I'm just bringing the kind of release mechanism 462 00:23:23,980 --> 00:23:26,860 that saves on the transport costs. It does. 463 00:23:26,860 --> 00:23:30,900 But, I mean, remember endorphins are related to morphine 464 00:23:30,900 --> 00:23:32,940 and the opiates in general, 465 00:23:32,940 --> 00:23:36,820 and that's why you get this kind of light-headed kind of relaxed feeling 466 00:23:36,820 --> 00:23:38,620 from them, they give you an opiate high. 467 00:23:38,620 --> 00:23:40,780 So, you're saying we should try drugs? Yeah, um... 468 00:23:40,780 --> 00:23:41,940 You spend all day... 469 00:23:41,940 --> 00:23:45,140 But the difference with endorphins is you don't get addicted to them 470 00:23:45,140 --> 00:23:49,660 in the way that you do the normal kind of morphine opiate-type drugs. 471 00:23:49,660 --> 00:23:51,780 Chemically, they're just slightly different, 472 00:23:51,780 --> 00:23:54,740 so you don't suffer that kind of physiological addiction. 473 00:23:54,740 --> 00:23:58,540 But the point is that laughter triggers that system, 474 00:23:58,540 --> 00:24:02,780 and then allows you in effect to groom with several other people 475 00:24:02,780 --> 00:24:04,380 at the same time, 476 00:24:04,380 --> 00:24:07,660 so it then becomes a much more efficient use of time. 477 00:24:07,660 --> 00:24:12,740 So, we can use the same amount of social time during the day, 478 00:24:12,740 --> 00:24:14,980 but groom with many more people. 479 00:24:14,980 --> 00:24:18,060 Fantastic, so that allows us to have bigger groups... Yeah. 480 00:24:18,060 --> 00:24:20,460 ..and therefore to specialise... Well, then you can have 481 00:24:20,460 --> 00:24:23,300 all the things that emerged out of our history, as it were, 482 00:24:23,300 --> 00:24:24,940 you know, sort of... 483 00:24:24,940 --> 00:24:27,580 You can have culture because you've got many more minds 484 00:24:27,580 --> 00:24:31,380 to create novel ideas - write books, tell jokes... 485 00:24:31,380 --> 00:24:35,500 Excellent. So, laughter is remote grooming, it's a social activity, 486 00:24:35,500 --> 00:24:37,540 and you're actually 30 times more likely to laugh 487 00:24:37,540 --> 00:24:39,580 when you're with other people. 488 00:24:39,580 --> 00:24:42,060 It's an intensely social activity, yes. 489 00:24:42,060 --> 00:24:46,140 I mean, it's this extraordinary contagion effect of it. 490 00:24:46,140 --> 00:24:51,540 So you could tell a joke in some language that I don't understand 491 00:24:51,540 --> 00:24:54,660 and everybody else laughs, I cannot help but laugh with you. 492 00:24:54,660 --> 00:24:57,540 I simply don't know why I'm laughing, but I have to do it. 493 00:24:57,540 --> 00:25:00,060 I weirdly have a thing in my relationship where we watch 494 00:25:00,060 --> 00:25:02,820 certain shows together that I'd never dream of watching 495 00:25:02,820 --> 00:25:04,100 without the other half. 496 00:25:04,100 --> 00:25:07,020 And there's a thing about if I do watch something on my own 497 00:25:07,020 --> 00:25:10,180 on the iPlayer on the computer, you find yourself going, 498 00:25:10,180 --> 00:25:12,860 "Oh, that was really funny," but I don't laugh. Yeah. Mmm-hmm. 499 00:25:12,860 --> 00:25:14,580 But if I'm with the other half at home, 500 00:25:14,580 --> 00:25:18,420 we just really fall about laughing, and it's a lovely... 501 00:25:18,420 --> 00:25:21,620 I don't know, it's a very comforting sound, hearing your partner laugh. 502 00:25:21,620 --> 00:25:23,500 OK, so we've put the theory to the test. 503 00:25:23,500 --> 00:25:25,900 We've isolated one of our audience members. 504 00:25:25,900 --> 00:25:27,740 Hello, Sherry. 505 00:25:27,740 --> 00:25:30,420 Hi, Jimmy. Hello. 506 00:25:30,420 --> 00:25:32,860 So, we've stuck you in isolation to watch the programme. 507 00:25:32,860 --> 00:25:34,180 Are you enjoying it? Yes. 508 00:25:35,300 --> 00:25:37,340 Good. LAUGHTER 509 00:25:37,340 --> 00:25:39,900 Well, it's been lovely chatting. 510 00:25:39,900 --> 00:25:41,700 So, you're on your own, watching the show. 511 00:25:41,700 --> 00:25:43,700 So we're going to have a look at your reaction 512 00:25:43,700 --> 00:25:46,500 to me telling jokes earlier, to see whether you laughed on your own. 513 00:25:46,500 --> 00:25:48,220 Let's have a look. 514 00:25:48,220 --> 00:25:51,020 ..designing GM crops and cloning designer babies 515 00:25:51,020 --> 00:25:52,460 to investigate laughter. 516 00:25:53,900 --> 00:25:55,980 AUDIENCE LAUGHS 517 00:25:55,980 --> 00:25:58,420 ..thermometer in her pocket and thinks... 518 00:25:58,420 --> 00:26:00,100 "some arsehole's got my pen." 519 00:26:02,220 --> 00:26:04,260 AUDIENCE LAUGHS 520 00:26:06,700 --> 00:26:09,340 So, Sherry, my question to you, why are you being a dick about it? 521 00:26:10,540 --> 00:26:12,380 I mean, it's a really good example, though, 522 00:26:12,380 --> 00:26:15,020 of you're watching the show and you seem pretty engaged, but... 523 00:26:15,020 --> 00:26:17,980 You're not laughing. I am laughing...inside. 524 00:26:19,500 --> 00:26:20,900 You're laughing on the inside? 525 00:26:22,020 --> 00:26:25,180 No, I mean that's... That's fair enough. 526 00:26:25,180 --> 00:26:27,820 And then we locked you in a room so you're... 527 00:26:27,820 --> 00:26:30,980 You're not well pre-disposed to... I just feel very much at home now, 528 00:26:30,980 --> 00:26:33,500 cos this is something that I do just at home by myself, 529 00:26:33,500 --> 00:26:35,140 watching you. 530 00:26:35,140 --> 00:26:37,540 LAUGHTER 531 00:26:40,820 --> 00:26:42,620 Well, you made this weird, Sherry. 532 00:26:43,940 --> 00:26:46,180 What I do on Snapchat is very much my own business. 533 00:26:47,700 --> 00:26:50,140 That's a... We'll get you to come into the studio 534 00:26:50,140 --> 00:26:52,380 for the rest of the show, because we've done this bit. 535 00:26:52,380 --> 00:26:55,460 But I think that really demonstrates that idea of the social activity, 536 00:26:55,460 --> 00:26:57,900 and I feel like, as my job being a stand-up, 537 00:26:57,900 --> 00:27:01,140 people come out to shows partly because they think the person 538 00:27:01,140 --> 00:27:03,460 onstage is funny, but partly because they want to laugh 539 00:27:03,460 --> 00:27:05,180 with their partner, with their friends. 540 00:27:05,180 --> 00:27:08,460 They sort of organically know that they enjoy that experience 541 00:27:08,460 --> 00:27:10,980 of being together with a room full of people 542 00:27:10,980 --> 00:27:12,900 that all have the same sense of humour as well. 543 00:27:12,900 --> 00:27:14,740 But what's kind of interesting, actually, 544 00:27:14,740 --> 00:27:18,860 if you looked round the room when you could hear laughter, 545 00:27:18,860 --> 00:27:21,300 it's not everybody that's laughing here. 546 00:27:21,300 --> 00:27:23,460 And in fact one of the weird things is, 547 00:27:23,460 --> 00:27:26,140 if you look at people in pubs laughing, 548 00:27:26,140 --> 00:27:29,140 you almost never get more than three people laughing together. 549 00:27:30,180 --> 00:27:33,420 But actually, if you think about it, that already makes laughter 550 00:27:33,420 --> 00:27:35,060 three times more efficient than grooming, 551 00:27:35,060 --> 00:27:37,700 for triggering the endorphin system, 552 00:27:37,700 --> 00:27:41,380 because when you groom, it's only the other person that gets the hit. 553 00:27:41,380 --> 00:27:45,380 When you laugh, you as the joke-teller, laugh as well. 554 00:27:45,380 --> 00:27:47,860 What you're saying there is when you tell a joke in a pub, 555 00:27:47,860 --> 00:27:49,180 three people laugh. No, two. 556 00:27:50,500 --> 00:27:52,220 And you laugh, yeah. I'm a pro, my friend. 557 00:27:52,220 --> 00:27:54,380 I can get the whole room. 558 00:27:54,380 --> 00:27:56,340 But most of the time, if you look, 559 00:27:56,340 --> 00:27:58,420 you've got...it's like a kind of Mexican wave effect. 560 00:27:58,420 --> 00:28:00,220 You've got little pockets laughing. 561 00:28:00,220 --> 00:28:02,900 It sounds like a lot of people laughing, but if you actually look, 562 00:28:02,900 --> 00:28:04,700 it's sort of going round in little waves. 563 00:28:04,700 --> 00:28:06,940 I often find that with certain types of jokes as well, 564 00:28:06,940 --> 00:28:08,940 you sort of have a ripple effect of... Yeah. 565 00:28:08,940 --> 00:28:11,020 ..people are laughing and then they're laughing 566 00:28:11,020 --> 00:28:13,860 at someone else laughing... And also a good laugher to trigger it. 567 00:28:13,860 --> 00:28:16,180 If you've got a good laugher, who laughs at everything, 568 00:28:16,180 --> 00:28:18,740 it will trigger the waves of laughter round the room. 569 00:28:18,740 --> 00:28:20,740 Oh, I work with several professionals. 570 00:28:22,700 --> 00:28:25,820 So, laughter is a group activity but it's also linked to grooming 571 00:28:25,820 --> 00:28:27,620 in that it strengthens relationships. 572 00:28:27,620 --> 00:28:30,540 Couples that laugh together, stay together - certainly makes sense. 573 00:28:30,540 --> 00:28:33,140 There must be something that's stopping the Chuckle Brothers 574 00:28:33,140 --> 00:28:35,180 from killing each other. Take a look. 575 00:28:39,260 --> 00:28:42,340 At the University of North Carolina, it's graduation time. 576 00:28:44,100 --> 00:28:47,340 Students may be leaving, but for staff like Sara Algoe, 577 00:28:47,340 --> 00:28:48,580 the work goes on. 578 00:28:50,940 --> 00:28:52,540 I was really interested in laughter 579 00:28:52,540 --> 00:28:55,260 because it seems like the kind of behaviour that happens 580 00:28:55,260 --> 00:28:58,740 really frequently and is so relevant to the way 581 00:28:58,740 --> 00:29:00,180 that people think about 582 00:29:00,180 --> 00:29:03,500 their best relationships, and yet there is very little research on it. 583 00:29:07,100 --> 00:29:10,100 In another disproportionately ugly psychology department... 584 00:29:11,220 --> 00:29:13,180 ..on an otherwise very pretty campus... 585 00:29:17,300 --> 00:29:21,460 ..Sarah's PhD student Laura Kurtz is running an experiment 586 00:29:21,460 --> 00:29:24,540 to try to put some numbers on the idea that people who laugh together 587 00:29:24,540 --> 00:29:25,980 stay together. 588 00:29:28,420 --> 00:29:30,100 For this first interaction, 589 00:29:30,100 --> 00:29:33,060 we're interested in hearing about the first time you met. 590 00:29:33,060 --> 00:29:35,100 What was the first thing you said to me? 591 00:29:35,100 --> 00:29:37,340 "I'm going to marry you one day," and you said, "No". 592 00:29:37,340 --> 00:29:41,620 What I really love about this research is that it's so intuitive, 593 00:29:41,620 --> 00:29:45,460 so everyone can think of a time when they laughed with somebody. 594 00:29:45,460 --> 00:29:48,180 So you can think of probably a time in the past day or two, 595 00:29:48,180 --> 00:29:51,420 when you laughed with your friend or your romantic partner, 596 00:29:51,420 --> 00:29:54,780 but we can also think of a time when we laughed at something 597 00:29:54,780 --> 00:29:57,220 but the person next to us did not laugh, 598 00:29:57,220 --> 00:29:59,060 and suddenly in that moment... 599 00:30:00,220 --> 00:30:02,940 ..what could have potentially been a really powerful thing, 600 00:30:02,940 --> 00:30:05,100 a powerful behaviour, all of a sudden takes a nosedive. 601 00:30:07,180 --> 00:30:09,860 After filling out a questionnaire that will tell the researchers 602 00:30:09,860 --> 00:30:12,100 how happy each of them is in their relationship, 603 00:30:12,100 --> 00:30:15,100 couples are recorded talking about the first time they met. 604 00:30:16,540 --> 00:30:18,100 Yeah. I thought that was really cute. 605 00:30:18,100 --> 00:30:20,820 It was cute. I was most probably lying about it, but... 606 00:30:22,260 --> 00:30:25,140 After the couples left the lab, 607 00:30:25,140 --> 00:30:27,100 we had a coder go back through all of those 608 00:30:27,100 --> 00:30:28,940 video-recorded interactions, 609 00:30:28,940 --> 00:30:32,820 coding for every start and stop time stamp of a laugh. 610 00:30:32,820 --> 00:30:35,460 You were expecting me to be boring? Well, you were a librarian. 611 00:30:35,460 --> 00:30:37,260 You read my e-mails. Yeah, but... 612 00:30:37,260 --> 00:30:39,820 Yeah, but it was still a librarian. I'm sorry! 613 00:30:39,820 --> 00:30:41,540 HE LAUGHS 614 00:30:41,540 --> 00:30:44,500 This is the way that we're able to quantify how much time 615 00:30:44,500 --> 00:30:47,220 they're spending actually laughing at exactly the same time, 616 00:30:47,220 --> 00:30:49,620 versus each person laughing separately. 617 00:30:51,860 --> 00:30:52,980 Oh, my gosh. 618 00:30:52,980 --> 00:30:57,060 So, what we found was that moments of shared laughter 619 00:30:57,060 --> 00:30:59,780 actually are predictive of greater closeness 620 00:30:59,780 --> 00:31:02,460 and feeling more supported by one's partner. 621 00:31:02,460 --> 00:31:05,500 So, those couples who laughed more tended to report more support 622 00:31:05,500 --> 00:31:08,340 and also generally feeling closer to their partner. 623 00:31:11,180 --> 00:31:14,420 I had my eye on somebody else at that time. Oh, really? Yes, I did. 624 00:31:14,420 --> 00:31:15,900 Oh, I didn't know that. 625 00:31:15,900 --> 00:31:17,260 HE LAUGHS 626 00:31:17,260 --> 00:31:19,380 So, the message is pretty clear. 627 00:31:19,380 --> 00:31:23,180 Folklore has it that laughter may well ignite romantic attachment... 628 00:31:24,380 --> 00:31:27,460 ..but science says, if you want to make it past infatuation... 629 00:31:27,460 --> 00:31:29,660 SHE GIGGLES ..and enjoy a long and happy 630 00:31:29,660 --> 00:31:32,700 relationship, you better carry on laughing. 631 00:31:38,660 --> 00:31:40,180 That was an interesting film. 632 00:31:40,180 --> 00:31:42,780 Finally, what every couple watching at home wants to see - 633 00:31:42,780 --> 00:31:45,820 a scientific way of determining exactly how doomed 634 00:31:45,820 --> 00:31:47,540 their relationship is. 635 00:31:47,540 --> 00:31:49,380 Well done, science. 636 00:31:49,380 --> 00:31:51,780 So, do couples that laugh together really stay together? 637 00:31:51,780 --> 00:31:54,860 One of the important things that kind of comes out of that, actually, 638 00:31:54,860 --> 00:31:58,420 I think, is that laughing together actually ramps up 639 00:31:58,420 --> 00:32:01,020 the endorphin production in the brain, 640 00:32:01,020 --> 00:32:03,700 it actually doubles it, in effect. 641 00:32:03,700 --> 00:32:06,020 We don't understand why, we have no idea why, 642 00:32:06,020 --> 00:32:09,300 but it's almost as though the system is designed to give you this 643 00:32:09,300 --> 00:32:12,420 sort of real boost. To encourage you to laugh with other people? 644 00:32:12,420 --> 00:32:14,140 Yeah, yeah. Yeah, buy two tickets. 645 00:32:15,500 --> 00:32:18,020 So, its sort of functionality is it releases endorphins 646 00:32:18,020 --> 00:32:20,420 and that feels good, but also it's a form of communication 647 00:32:20,420 --> 00:32:22,460 in and of itself? Yeah, and it lets you, together, 648 00:32:22,460 --> 00:32:25,100 regulate your emotions, cos it only works if both of you do it. 649 00:32:25,100 --> 00:32:27,100 If one person's going, "Ha-ha, it was funny," 650 00:32:27,100 --> 00:32:30,020 and the other person's going, "No, it was quite a serious problem," 651 00:32:30,020 --> 00:32:32,100 they're not... It's not going to work. 652 00:32:32,100 --> 00:32:34,100 So, there's two different types of laughter - 653 00:32:34,100 --> 00:32:35,900 there's laughter you do when you hear a joke 654 00:32:35,900 --> 00:32:37,300 and there's social laughter, 655 00:32:37,300 --> 00:32:39,300 laughter that peppers our communications. 656 00:32:39,300 --> 00:32:41,380 There's real laughter, at stuff we find funny, 657 00:32:41,380 --> 00:32:45,460 and there's posed laughter, which serves a vital social function. 658 00:32:45,460 --> 00:32:47,300 Sophie, you've done work on this, right? 659 00:32:47,300 --> 00:32:49,500 Yes, we've been looking at it in quite a lot of detail, 660 00:32:49,500 --> 00:32:51,940 because it does seem to be, essentially, 661 00:32:51,940 --> 00:32:54,980 two entirely different kinds of laughter that we use. 662 00:32:54,980 --> 00:32:58,180 Posed laughter - that sounds like... Is that someone going, "Ha-ha...ha"? 663 00:32:58,180 --> 00:33:00,860 Well, it could be. It's... LAUGHTER 664 00:33:00,860 --> 00:33:04,100 It sounds really bad, sort of... 665 00:33:04,100 --> 00:33:06,340 It was like you bounced it straight back. 666 00:33:06,340 --> 00:33:08,700 SHE LAUGHS That was real. Yeah. 667 00:33:10,020 --> 00:33:12,580 It sounds awful to say, "Who would want fake laughter? 668 00:33:12,580 --> 00:33:15,500 "I don't want you putting that on," but actually most of the laughter 669 00:33:15,500 --> 00:33:19,140 you encounter in conversations is so well-coordinated 670 00:33:19,140 --> 00:33:21,140 with the conversation that you're having, 671 00:33:21,140 --> 00:33:24,620 that it has to be part of your voluntary communication system. 672 00:33:24,620 --> 00:33:27,500 If you look at people laughing when they're having conversational... 673 00:33:27,500 --> 00:33:30,180 and they're talking to each other, they don't laugh randomly, 674 00:33:30,180 --> 00:33:32,860 they laugh at the ends of sentences, and then you start again 675 00:33:32,860 --> 00:33:34,980 and maybe somebody else picks up or you carry on. 676 00:33:34,980 --> 00:33:38,020 OK, well, shall we play in some real and some posed laughter 677 00:33:38,020 --> 00:33:40,300 and see if people can differentiate? 678 00:33:40,300 --> 00:33:42,820 OK, so... Well, take it away, Sophie. 679 00:33:42,820 --> 00:33:45,420 OK, we've got somebody laughing here. They may look familiar. 680 00:33:50,140 --> 00:33:51,660 OK, what do you think, audience? 681 00:33:51,660 --> 00:33:53,700 AUDIENCE: Real. Real. 682 00:33:53,700 --> 00:33:56,100 Does everyone think it's real? Does anyone think it's posed? 683 00:33:56,100 --> 00:33:58,060 Posed. 684 00:33:58,060 --> 00:34:00,060 Who thinks it's posed? 685 00:34:00,060 --> 00:34:03,780 And you're saying that only a psychopath would do that, yeah? 686 00:34:03,780 --> 00:34:05,660 And they need to be institutionalised now. 687 00:34:05,660 --> 00:34:09,740 We'd need more than N=1 for data, but it's a worrying start. 688 00:34:09,740 --> 00:34:12,540 I'm fairly certain that one's real cos I start crying when I laugh. 689 00:34:16,020 --> 00:34:18,700 TYPEWRITER PINGS 690 00:34:18,700 --> 00:34:21,100 OK, let's have an old-style typewriter write it in green. 691 00:34:22,740 --> 00:34:24,860 If that doesn't say Horizon, I don't know what... 692 00:34:24,860 --> 00:34:25,980 That's science, my friend. 693 00:34:25,980 --> 00:34:29,420 That's a real laugh. See if we can try another one. 694 00:34:33,780 --> 00:34:35,340 OK, so real or posed? 695 00:34:35,340 --> 00:34:38,580 AUDIENCE: Posed. Posed. And does anyone think it's real? 696 00:34:38,580 --> 00:34:40,380 Genuinely, if anyone thought... It's fine. 697 00:34:44,460 --> 00:34:46,620 I can see maybe someone does and then they're going, 698 00:34:46,620 --> 00:34:48,140 "I'd better not say." 699 00:34:52,980 --> 00:34:55,540 Posed laughs, they've got their own thing going on. 700 00:34:55,540 --> 00:34:57,540 They're not just weak versions of real laughs. 701 00:34:57,540 --> 00:35:01,340 So, you quite often get nasality, a kind of heh-heh-heh quality 702 00:35:01,340 --> 00:35:05,180 to posed laughter that you never, ever find in spontaneous laughter, 703 00:35:05,180 --> 00:35:07,860 in fact, you couldn't do that when you were laughing helplessly. 704 00:35:07,860 --> 00:35:10,580 It's like we're marking it, we're showing it for what it is. 705 00:35:10,580 --> 00:35:12,860 I'm giving you my laughter. I'm voluntarily giving you 706 00:35:12,860 --> 00:35:13,940 this laughter. 707 00:35:13,940 --> 00:35:15,620 So we're going out of our way, possibly, 708 00:35:15,620 --> 00:35:18,860 to actually show people that this is a voluntary behaviour. 709 00:35:18,860 --> 00:35:22,460 OK, so we humans are not the only mammals that laugh. 710 00:35:22,460 --> 00:35:25,580 Now, can any other animal fake laugh? 711 00:35:25,580 --> 00:35:28,140 In chimpanzees, you do seem to find something that looks like 712 00:35:28,140 --> 00:35:30,780 a difference between a spontaneous laugh and a posed laugh. 713 00:35:30,780 --> 00:35:34,220 So, chimps laugh differently if they are being tickled 714 00:35:34,220 --> 00:35:37,180 than if they're trying to make play last longer, so that's... 715 00:35:37,180 --> 00:35:40,100 What if they're filming something for PG Tips? 716 00:35:40,100 --> 00:35:42,540 Cos often they've heard those jokes before. 717 00:35:42,540 --> 00:35:43,780 They're being polite. 718 00:35:43,780 --> 00:35:47,100 Yeah, so can we demonstrate that humans are the only ones 719 00:35:47,100 --> 00:35:49,260 that really know how to pose laughter? 720 00:35:49,260 --> 00:35:50,900 We're going to try this. 721 00:35:50,900 --> 00:35:52,740 I think we have a volunteer over there. 722 00:35:52,740 --> 00:35:54,340 Yes, you're our volunteer, come up. 723 00:35:54,340 --> 00:35:55,780 What's your name, sir? Phil. 724 00:35:55,780 --> 00:35:57,740 Hello, Phil, how are you? I'm good, thank you. 725 00:35:57,740 --> 00:36:02,660 I believe we need you to regress maybe ten million years, is it? 726 00:36:02,660 --> 00:36:03,780 How far are we going back? 727 00:36:03,780 --> 00:36:06,300 We're sending him back to walk on all fours. 728 00:36:06,300 --> 00:36:10,180 I'll cede knowledge here to Robin, but we need a quadruped. 729 00:36:10,180 --> 00:36:11,820 Just here is fine. I don't know if you... 730 00:36:11,820 --> 00:36:13,220 Yeah, go ahead, dude. 731 00:36:14,260 --> 00:36:17,500 There we go. Ah, you left your dignity at the table. 732 00:36:17,500 --> 00:36:19,740 LAUGHTER 733 00:36:19,740 --> 00:36:22,500 "Yeah, Mum, it's great news, I'm going to be on Horizon, but..." 734 00:36:23,980 --> 00:36:26,060 As soon as you start having to do this, 735 00:36:26,060 --> 00:36:28,780 you're having to use your four limbs, like all other mammals, 736 00:36:28,780 --> 00:36:31,140 to support your weight, and that means you can't use them 737 00:36:31,140 --> 00:36:34,340 for all that fine stuff we're doing when we're using our voice 738 00:36:34,340 --> 00:36:37,180 voluntarily - we're talking, we're doing social laughter. 739 00:36:37,180 --> 00:36:40,420 So, this is a slightly strange way of demonstrating 740 00:36:40,420 --> 00:36:43,500 how weirdly dependent we are on actually the fact that we're walking 741 00:36:43,500 --> 00:36:45,900 upright for a lot of the stuff we can do with our voices. 742 00:36:45,900 --> 00:36:48,380 So, could you fake a laugh now in that position, is that...? 743 00:36:48,380 --> 00:36:50,300 HE LAUGHS AND SPLUTTERS 744 00:36:50,300 --> 00:36:51,980 AUDIENCE LAUGH 745 00:36:51,980 --> 00:36:53,700 No, not really. 746 00:36:53,700 --> 00:36:55,060 I mean, definitively not. 747 00:36:55,060 --> 00:36:57,660 And we need him there for the rest of the show. 748 00:36:58,740 --> 00:37:01,260 It's a shame, really. He was probably quite enjoying it. 749 00:37:02,820 --> 00:37:05,340 See, now... So you're saying the reason we can fake laughter 750 00:37:05,340 --> 00:37:07,980 is cos we're bipeds... Bipeds, yeah. ..and if we had to walk on 751 00:37:07,980 --> 00:37:09,900 all fours, as this man has to... LAUGHTER 752 00:37:11,140 --> 00:37:14,540 Contractually obliged to walk like this for the rest of the show. 753 00:37:14,540 --> 00:37:16,020 I mean... 754 00:37:16,020 --> 00:37:18,740 Probably a kinder sort of host would've got you to stand up 755 00:37:18,740 --> 00:37:20,460 by now, but... 756 00:37:20,460 --> 00:37:22,900 Go on, you'd better stand up. Our volunteer, everyone. 757 00:37:22,900 --> 00:37:25,740 Thank you very much. Great demonstration. It worked. 758 00:37:29,700 --> 00:37:31,620 So that kind of tightness in speech 759 00:37:31,620 --> 00:37:34,460 and the idea that you couldn't really sort of relax and pose 760 00:37:34,460 --> 00:37:37,300 and enjoy it as much if you're kind of, yeah. 761 00:37:37,300 --> 00:37:40,180 Absolutely. I mean, if you stress it even more, if you've got... 762 00:37:40,180 --> 00:37:42,380 you know, you try and take all your weight onto your arms, 763 00:37:42,380 --> 00:37:45,620 like doing pull-ups, then you just can't talk, you can't laugh, 764 00:37:45,620 --> 00:37:46,780 you can't do anything. 765 00:37:46,780 --> 00:37:49,900 So, I believe we have some brain scans of real and posed laughter. 766 00:37:49,900 --> 00:37:52,140 We do. Let's have a look at some brain scans, everyone. 767 00:37:53,780 --> 00:37:56,820 So, what we did here is we played people some sounds 768 00:37:56,820 --> 00:37:59,060 and buried in there we had real laughs and posed laughs. 769 00:37:59,060 --> 00:38:01,780 We didn't tell people anything about what they were going to hear, 770 00:38:01,780 --> 00:38:03,940 and we didn't tell them anything about laughter, 771 00:38:03,940 --> 00:38:05,980 and what we found is that the brain still cares. 772 00:38:05,980 --> 00:38:08,780 You get different patterns of activation when you hear real laughs 773 00:38:08,780 --> 00:38:12,300 versus posed laughs. So, for example, these regions here in blue, 774 00:38:12,300 --> 00:38:15,420 they're showing you areas of activation in the auditory cortices, 775 00:38:15,420 --> 00:38:17,220 just here above your ears, 776 00:38:17,220 --> 00:38:19,660 and that is greater for the real laughs 777 00:38:19,660 --> 00:38:21,700 than the posed laughs, significantly greater. 778 00:38:21,700 --> 00:38:24,660 And what that seems to be because is when you hear real laughter, 779 00:38:24,660 --> 00:38:27,300 you hear all these sounds you do not hear in any other context. 780 00:38:27,300 --> 00:38:30,020 It's completely sort of unambiguous. 781 00:38:30,020 --> 00:38:33,420 In contrast, we all see all these regions in pink, 782 00:38:33,420 --> 00:38:36,340 which are significantly more active to the posed laughter, 783 00:38:36,340 --> 00:38:39,100 and this is a bit surprising to us, cos we were expecting the brain 784 00:38:39,100 --> 00:38:42,020 to care very much about posed laughter as it's a bit, you know, 785 00:38:42,020 --> 00:38:43,740 it's not spontaneous, it's not real, 786 00:38:43,740 --> 00:38:46,140 but in fact it gives you more activation. 787 00:38:46,140 --> 00:38:48,820 And the activation it's giving you is not in auditory parts 788 00:38:48,820 --> 00:38:51,500 of the brain, it's in the parts of the brain you would expect to find 789 00:38:51,500 --> 00:38:53,700 if you were to sit down and deliberately think about 790 00:38:53,700 --> 00:38:56,380 what somebody else is thinking. So, I think what this speaks to 791 00:38:56,380 --> 00:38:58,540 is the fact that when you hear somebody producing 792 00:38:58,540 --> 00:39:01,220 a clearly posed laugh - a-ha-ha-ha - 793 00:39:01,220 --> 00:39:04,380 there is some reason why that human being has produced that behaviour 794 00:39:04,380 --> 00:39:06,300 and you are trying to work it out. 795 00:39:06,300 --> 00:39:09,020 Are they laughing cos they're in pain? Cos they're embarrassed? 796 00:39:09,020 --> 00:39:11,140 Cos they like you? Cos they want you to like them? 797 00:39:11,140 --> 00:39:12,620 There's a reason why they're doing it 798 00:39:12,620 --> 00:39:14,380 and that's why you're dwelling on it, 799 00:39:14,380 --> 00:39:16,860 even if you're having your brain scanned and it sounds like 800 00:39:16,860 --> 00:39:18,260 it's got nothing to do with you. 801 00:39:18,260 --> 00:39:20,140 It's such an important social signal. 802 00:39:20,140 --> 00:39:22,340 So, what happens if someone doesn't have the ability 803 00:39:22,340 --> 00:39:23,660 to tell the difference? 804 00:39:23,660 --> 00:39:25,460 Well, this is a very interesting question 805 00:39:25,460 --> 00:39:27,220 that we're trying to go into at the moment. 806 00:39:27,220 --> 00:39:30,260 So we've been doing some work, looking at how laughter is perceived 807 00:39:30,260 --> 00:39:33,020 by people with different kinds of problems. 808 00:39:33,020 --> 00:39:35,740 We've done some work in collaboration with colleagues at UCL 809 00:39:35,740 --> 00:39:38,980 looking at teenagers who have conduct disorders, 810 00:39:38,980 --> 00:39:41,660 and what you find is that, although the can behaviourally 811 00:39:41,660 --> 00:39:44,460 tell the difference between real and posed laughter, 812 00:39:44,460 --> 00:39:46,540 what they can't do, what they don't seem to do, 813 00:39:46,540 --> 00:39:48,580 is to show this contagion. 814 00:39:48,580 --> 00:39:50,460 They don't show this behavioural reaction, 815 00:39:50,460 --> 00:39:52,820 so they don't want to join in when they hear the laughter 816 00:39:52,820 --> 00:39:55,260 and their brains respond differently to the laughter. 817 00:39:55,260 --> 00:39:58,300 So there does seem to be something genuinely different happening 818 00:39:58,300 --> 00:40:00,300 when people process laughter 819 00:40:00,300 --> 00:40:03,180 who are at risk of having more serious problems, 820 00:40:03,180 --> 00:40:05,180 in terms of their social interactions. 821 00:40:05,180 --> 00:40:06,860 Wow, interesting. 822 00:40:06,860 --> 00:40:09,180 OK, so we've found out what laughter is 823 00:40:09,180 --> 00:40:10,860 and we know why we enjoy doing it. 824 00:40:10,860 --> 00:40:14,300 Final question - why do we laugh when we find things funny? 825 00:40:14,300 --> 00:40:17,180 Well, if only someone had a grand, unifying theory of comedy. 826 00:40:17,180 --> 00:40:18,380 Bit of luck - they do. 827 00:40:25,100 --> 00:40:28,060 Nestling beneath America's mighty Rocky Mountains 828 00:40:28,060 --> 00:40:30,580 is the University of Colorado at Boulder. 829 00:40:37,300 --> 00:40:41,020 One of its many architecturally unambitious buildings contains a man 830 00:40:41,020 --> 00:40:44,180 who claims to have discovered why we find things funny. 831 00:40:46,020 --> 00:40:48,260 His name is Professor Peter McGraw. 832 00:40:49,660 --> 00:40:52,780 We're at the University of Colorado, Boulder, at the lead school 833 00:40:52,780 --> 00:40:55,380 and we're headed to the human research lab 834 00:40:55,380 --> 00:40:59,220 which we affectionately refer to as HuRL. 835 00:40:59,220 --> 00:41:02,500 Unfortunately, even the science of humour 836 00:41:02,500 --> 00:41:04,420 has a kind of boring backdrop. 837 00:41:04,420 --> 00:41:06,620 I wish I could tell you that in a room over here 838 00:41:06,620 --> 00:41:10,620 we had a whole bunch of rubber chickens and whoopee cushions 839 00:41:10,620 --> 00:41:13,020 that we need to just pull out for our studies. 840 00:41:15,100 --> 00:41:19,740 Yet, despite, or maybe because of, this anodyne beige interior, 841 00:41:19,740 --> 00:41:22,420 it's here that Professor McGraw has devised 842 00:41:22,420 --> 00:41:25,660 his grand, unified theory of comedy. 843 00:41:25,660 --> 00:41:29,300 Humour deconstructed, laid bare and explained. 844 00:41:32,180 --> 00:41:35,060 So, most things in the world are OK. 845 00:41:36,300 --> 00:41:37,380 They're benign. 846 00:41:39,860 --> 00:41:41,700 They're not funny. 847 00:41:41,700 --> 00:41:44,780 And then, of course, there's a certain set of things in the world, 848 00:41:44,780 --> 00:41:46,300 you know, whether it be... 849 00:41:47,580 --> 00:41:50,660 ..bad traffic or an annoying co-worker... 850 00:41:53,140 --> 00:41:54,500 ..a tragedy... 851 00:41:56,220 --> 00:41:57,340 ..that's a violation. 852 00:41:59,180 --> 00:42:03,860 This creates a boring reaction, this creates a negative reaction. 853 00:42:03,860 --> 00:42:06,580 But when you bring these two appraisals together 854 00:42:06,580 --> 00:42:09,820 and you create a benign violation, 855 00:42:09,820 --> 00:42:14,780 this sort of sweet spot that sits between being bored 856 00:42:14,780 --> 00:42:17,020 and being offended, 857 00:42:17,020 --> 00:42:22,100 and you have this moment of levity, this uplifting feeling of amusement, 858 00:42:22,100 --> 00:42:23,700 you say, "Hey, that's funny," 859 00:42:23,700 --> 00:42:25,980 and then you laugh to communicate to others 860 00:42:25,980 --> 00:42:28,300 that this violation is actually benign. 861 00:42:33,500 --> 00:42:35,900 Word of the theory's power has spread. 862 00:42:37,540 --> 00:42:40,140 Local comedian Nathan Lund is keen to see 863 00:42:40,140 --> 00:42:43,020 if benign violation theory can rescue one of his jokes 864 00:42:43,020 --> 00:42:45,660 that even he thinks might be too offensive. 865 00:42:48,940 --> 00:42:51,940 What's the joke? Saying that I've been working on 866 00:42:51,940 --> 00:42:54,220 a type of clear mayonnaise 867 00:42:54,220 --> 00:42:57,020 called I Can't believe It's Not Cum, but... 868 00:42:57,020 --> 00:42:58,260 But that's... 869 00:42:58,260 --> 00:43:01,700 That's kind of a violation... That goes too far. 870 00:43:01,700 --> 00:43:04,380 Yeah, that one goes too far, right? It might. I don't know yet. 871 00:43:04,380 --> 00:43:05,940 People... When it gets that "Uuggh." 872 00:43:05,940 --> 00:43:09,260 I also wonder if it's just too much, like, to go from, 873 00:43:09,260 --> 00:43:12,300 you know, clear mustard, that's pretty harmless, 874 00:43:12,300 --> 00:43:14,700 and then all of a sudden I'm bringing up... 875 00:43:14,700 --> 00:43:15,940 You know. 876 00:43:17,420 --> 00:43:20,900 After much debate, Professor McGraw and Nathan Lund come up with 877 00:43:20,900 --> 00:43:24,060 a solution they hope moves the joke away from violation 878 00:43:24,060 --> 00:43:25,900 just far enough to be funny. 879 00:43:30,780 --> 00:43:31,980 Happy to have him here. 880 00:43:31,980 --> 00:43:33,980 Please give a nice Boulder Comedy Show welcome 881 00:43:33,980 --> 00:43:35,620 to Nathan Lund, everybody. 882 00:43:37,860 --> 00:43:40,380 Now it's crunch time for clear mayonnaise, 883 00:43:40,380 --> 00:43:43,580 for Nathan and for benign violation theory. 884 00:43:43,580 --> 00:43:46,220 I don't have a lot of money, I'm hoping to make some money this year 885 00:43:46,220 --> 00:43:48,420 with a new product I have coming out. 886 00:43:48,420 --> 00:43:50,260 Clear mustard is what I've invented. 887 00:43:50,260 --> 00:43:52,260 I'm calling it Ham Sanitizer. 888 00:43:52,260 --> 00:43:53,740 LAUGHTER 889 00:43:53,740 --> 00:43:58,700 So, if you see Ham Sanitizer in stores, that's me, give it a shot. 890 00:44:00,500 --> 00:44:04,900 But I'm also working on a follow-up condiment - clear mayonnaise, 891 00:44:04,900 --> 00:44:07,340 which I'm calling I Can't believe It's Not Semen. 892 00:44:07,340 --> 00:44:09,420 LAUGHTER So, if you see... 893 00:44:09,420 --> 00:44:14,100 If you see that, that means people have been buying Ham Sanitizer, 894 00:44:14,100 --> 00:44:19,180 if I can follow it up with more clear condiments. 895 00:44:19,180 --> 00:44:21,780 So, do I have to explain all forms of comedy 896 00:44:21,780 --> 00:44:23,380 for this theory to be right? 897 00:44:23,380 --> 00:44:24,580 No. 898 00:44:24,580 --> 00:44:27,460 I just have to be able to explain comedy better 899 00:44:27,460 --> 00:44:29,660 than the other humour theories. 900 00:44:29,660 --> 00:44:31,980 And so, in many ways, it's kind of a horse race 901 00:44:31,980 --> 00:44:33,940 and I think I have a pretty fast horse. 902 00:44:33,940 --> 00:44:36,300 APPLAUSE 903 00:44:36,300 --> 00:44:39,620 Well, freshly arrived from Colorado in a matter transporter 904 00:44:39,620 --> 00:44:42,260 that we'll be looking at in next week's Horizon, 905 00:44:42,260 --> 00:44:45,660 ladies and gentlemen, please welcome Professor Peter McGraw. 906 00:44:45,660 --> 00:44:47,580 APPLAUSE 907 00:44:49,460 --> 00:44:51,260 Thank you for coming. 908 00:44:51,260 --> 00:44:52,500 Come in, take a seat. 909 00:44:52,500 --> 00:44:54,660 So, you think you have a pretty fast horse, 910 00:44:54,660 --> 00:44:57,100 you think your theory is pretty good on comedy. 911 00:44:57,100 --> 00:45:01,580 I mean, there's not a lot of good competition, so... 912 00:45:01,580 --> 00:45:04,900 Well, there's three main theories on comedy, 913 00:45:04,900 --> 00:45:07,740 so let's go through those first. Sure, sure. 914 00:45:07,740 --> 00:45:11,140 So, these are, these theories go back 2,500 years 915 00:45:11,140 --> 00:45:12,740 to Plato and Aristotle. 916 00:45:12,740 --> 00:45:14,580 So, Robin will remember some of them. 917 00:45:14,580 --> 00:45:17,780 LAUGHTER 918 00:45:17,780 --> 00:45:19,780 Go on. So, the first theory... 919 00:45:19,780 --> 00:45:21,620 ..is superiority theory. 920 00:45:21,620 --> 00:45:25,340 And this is the notion that comedy is a game - 921 00:45:25,340 --> 00:45:27,260 there's a winner, there's a loser - 922 00:45:27,260 --> 00:45:29,460 and we laugh at other people's follies. 923 00:45:29,460 --> 00:45:32,540 OK, excellent, so that's the first theory. First theory. Superiority. 924 00:45:32,540 --> 00:45:36,060 And then there's release theory or relief theory. 925 00:45:36,060 --> 00:45:39,540 Er, Freud gets a lot of the credit for this. 926 00:45:39,540 --> 00:45:45,060 And the notion is that we laugh at things that kind of release 927 00:45:45,060 --> 00:45:47,580 these sort of sexual and aggressive tendencies 928 00:45:47,580 --> 00:45:48,860 that we sort of hide away, 929 00:45:48,860 --> 00:45:52,140 that are part of our personality that are not supposed to come out, 930 00:45:52,140 --> 00:45:56,820 and so comedy is a safe way for these things to come out. 931 00:45:56,820 --> 00:45:57,860 OK, and the third theory? 932 00:45:57,860 --> 00:45:59,260 Is incongruity theory. 933 00:45:59,260 --> 00:46:02,380 Which is the big... It's the big one, it's the 800 pound gorilla. 934 00:46:02,380 --> 00:46:05,340 It's the one that people sort of spontaneously come up with 935 00:46:05,340 --> 00:46:07,420 when you ask them what makes things funny, 936 00:46:07,420 --> 00:46:10,300 and it takes various forms but the most common 937 00:46:10,300 --> 00:46:13,660 is sort of a mismatch of expectations and reality. 938 00:46:13,660 --> 00:46:16,300 So you expect one thing and you get something else, 939 00:46:16,300 --> 00:46:18,380 and that is supposed to be delighting. 940 00:46:18,380 --> 00:46:20,580 OK, so those are the three main theories in comedy, 941 00:46:20,580 --> 00:46:22,140 and had been for a very long time. 942 00:46:22,140 --> 00:46:24,500 Yes. No-one's really given it much thought beyond that. 943 00:46:24,500 --> 00:46:27,140 So your theory is, again, benign violation. 944 00:46:27,140 --> 00:46:28,460 That's right, yeah. 945 00:46:28,460 --> 00:46:32,180 So, the theory takes into account that many of the things 946 00:46:32,180 --> 00:46:35,020 that we laugh at kind of have a dark side, 947 00:46:35,020 --> 00:46:37,020 so that's acknowledged in superiority theory, 948 00:46:37,020 --> 00:46:38,860 it's acknowledged in relief theory. 949 00:46:38,860 --> 00:46:42,300 That is that there's something wrong, there's something amiss, 950 00:46:42,300 --> 00:46:44,740 there's something threatening about that situation. 951 00:46:44,740 --> 00:46:47,580 But of course the things that are wrong or amiss and threatening, 952 00:46:47,580 --> 00:46:49,820 they don't make us laugh, they make us cry, 953 00:46:49,820 --> 00:46:52,540 they disgust us, they offend us. 954 00:46:52,540 --> 00:46:55,300 And so you have this negative arousal 955 00:46:55,300 --> 00:46:57,340 that comes from that dark side, 956 00:46:57,340 --> 00:47:00,580 and then it flips and then you delight 957 00:47:00,580 --> 00:47:03,940 and you have this positively arousing feeling, and then... 958 00:47:03,940 --> 00:47:07,620 I like to believe that laughter is that signal that this situation 959 00:47:07,620 --> 00:47:09,700 that seems wrong is actually OK. 960 00:47:09,700 --> 00:47:11,740 I mean, the thing I love about your theory 961 00:47:11,740 --> 00:47:14,420 is the idea that everyone has a different Venn diagram. 962 00:47:14,420 --> 00:47:16,340 Yes. Everyone's drawn it very differently. 963 00:47:16,340 --> 00:47:17,940 So something that I might find... 964 00:47:17,940 --> 00:47:19,940 I might say, "Well, that isn't a violation to me, 965 00:47:19,940 --> 00:47:21,340 "I'm happy to laugh about that," 966 00:47:21,340 --> 00:47:23,660 someone else might go, "Not on the BBC, thank you." 967 00:47:23,660 --> 00:47:26,180 And someone else might go, "You gotta give me more." 968 00:47:26,180 --> 00:47:29,420 The things that are wrong, and the things that are OK in the world 969 00:47:29,420 --> 00:47:31,260 change over time. 970 00:47:31,260 --> 00:47:34,540 So you listen back to old comedy 971 00:47:34,540 --> 00:47:38,100 and sometimes it's horribly offensive and bigoted now, 972 00:47:38,100 --> 00:47:39,380 from our perspective, 973 00:47:39,380 --> 00:47:42,260 and sometimes it's totally boring and confusing, 974 00:47:42,260 --> 00:47:44,900 and it's because the world has changed. 975 00:47:44,900 --> 00:47:47,100 And so, in many ways, 976 00:47:47,100 --> 00:47:52,220 good comedy really reflects the values of a society 977 00:47:52,220 --> 00:47:55,300 and the moral norms and the beliefs in a society, 978 00:47:55,300 --> 00:47:57,420 and those are constantly in flux. 979 00:47:57,420 --> 00:47:59,100 So, it's not just the individuals that move 980 00:47:59,100 --> 00:48:01,740 those kind of Venn diagrams of, you know, where that line is, 981 00:48:01,740 --> 00:48:03,780 it's a society as a whole that moves them 982 00:48:03,780 --> 00:48:06,660 and different nations have them in different places as well, yeah. 983 00:48:06,660 --> 00:48:08,820 Yes. Every so often you find something that lasts. 984 00:48:08,820 --> 00:48:10,540 I mean, it still won't last forever, 985 00:48:10,540 --> 00:48:14,140 but my son is very keen on listening to 986 00:48:14,140 --> 00:48:16,260 very old Tony Hancock radio programmes, 987 00:48:16,260 --> 00:48:18,580 and it's surprising how much of that has lasted, 988 00:48:18,580 --> 00:48:21,220 probably because it was hugely influential. 989 00:48:21,220 --> 00:48:24,340 It was basically you could draw a line straight from that to Seinfeld, 990 00:48:24,340 --> 00:48:27,900 and it's quite interesting how every so often you run across something 991 00:48:27,900 --> 00:48:29,580 that's almost jarringly out of place. 992 00:48:29,580 --> 00:48:31,500 It's very interesting, from my perspective, 993 00:48:31,500 --> 00:48:32,820 the kind of comedy that I do, 994 00:48:32,820 --> 00:48:36,460 the idea that no-one's ever laughed at an offensive joke, 995 00:48:36,460 --> 00:48:39,220 because, by dint of laughing, they're saying that, 996 00:48:39,220 --> 00:48:41,940 "No, this isn't a violation to me, this is all fine." 997 00:48:41,940 --> 00:48:43,580 Mm-hmm. We can laugh about anything. 998 00:48:43,580 --> 00:48:45,940 It's not that it's completely fine, right? 999 00:48:45,940 --> 00:48:49,780 That's the thing that's so difficult about it all. 1000 00:48:49,780 --> 00:48:51,700 The things that are completely fine 1001 00:48:51,700 --> 00:48:55,340 is like you listening to me, not very funny. 1002 00:48:55,340 --> 00:48:59,300 Right? And so, there has to be something edgy that plays that role. 1003 00:48:59,300 --> 00:49:02,260 This guy. This guy right here. I think... I really like the theory. 1004 00:49:02,260 --> 00:49:04,300 I mean, I really feel like it makes sense to me 1005 00:49:04,300 --> 00:49:05,660 in a way that the others don't. 1006 00:49:05,660 --> 00:49:09,180 But I'd be very interested to know what Sophie and Robin make of this. 1007 00:49:09,180 --> 00:49:10,220 No pressure. 1008 00:49:10,220 --> 00:49:14,020 Well, I was going to say, actually, this is kind of interesting because, 1009 00:49:14,020 --> 00:49:17,500 if you look at the origins of laughter as we have it in humans, 1010 00:49:17,500 --> 00:49:20,780 it actually comes from the play vocalisation in monkeys and apes, 1011 00:49:20,780 --> 00:49:26,140 and what that basically is is a comment on what I'm doing now. 1012 00:49:26,140 --> 00:49:28,100 When I bite you, don't take it seriously. 1013 00:49:28,100 --> 00:49:30,100 So, it's doing exactly this, 1014 00:49:30,100 --> 00:49:33,980 it's just saying, "Look, it may look aggressive, but actually it's not." 1015 00:49:33,980 --> 00:49:36,500 And I think it's... The thing I find interesting, 1016 00:49:36,500 --> 00:49:38,020 and you mentioned it in the film, 1017 00:49:38,020 --> 00:49:40,980 is that people are kind of appraising the situation, 1018 00:49:40,980 --> 00:49:42,700 they're coming to a decision about it. 1019 00:49:42,700 --> 00:49:44,780 And there is some very interesting data 1020 00:49:44,780 --> 00:49:47,540 showing that people will rate jokes as being funnier 1021 00:49:47,540 --> 00:49:50,020 if they think they've been told by a comedian 1022 00:49:50,020 --> 00:49:53,740 than if they think they've been told by somebody who's famous but not... 1023 00:49:53,740 --> 00:49:55,100 does not have that role. 1024 00:49:55,100 --> 00:49:57,500 So, if somebody thinks a joke's been told by Jimmy Carr, 1025 00:49:57,500 --> 00:49:59,180 they'll rate it as more amusing 1026 00:49:59,180 --> 00:50:01,580 than if they think it's been told by Jamie Oliver, 1027 00:50:01,580 --> 00:50:05,060 and that does suggest that people aren't just... 1028 00:50:05,060 --> 00:50:08,900 Their appraisal is including the person who is producing it. 1029 00:50:08,900 --> 00:50:11,940 And I think that kind of might speak in, socially, 1030 00:50:11,940 --> 00:50:14,980 to the kind of the people who you will and won't let make you laugh. 1031 00:50:14,980 --> 00:50:17,820 You know, you are going to laugh more with people you know and like, 1032 00:50:17,820 --> 00:50:20,300 and you may read their intentions as being more benign. 1033 00:50:20,300 --> 00:50:22,940 I think that's very true of political correctness as well, 1034 00:50:22,940 --> 00:50:26,340 cos I often get called out for saying, "Oh, you're not very politically correct," 1035 00:50:26,340 --> 00:50:27,980 but I always think I am within context. 1036 00:50:27,980 --> 00:50:30,180 Onstage, in front of 1,000 people, telling jokes, 1037 00:50:30,180 --> 00:50:33,220 political correctness doesn't really belong in that space for me. 1038 00:50:33,220 --> 00:50:35,500 So, as soon as whenever you get called out by the press 1039 00:50:35,500 --> 00:50:37,540 as a comedian and they say, "Ban this filth," 1040 00:50:37,540 --> 00:50:39,780 it tends to be that they've taken it from a comedy show, 1041 00:50:39,780 --> 00:50:41,380 put it on the front of the Daily Mail 1042 00:50:41,380 --> 00:50:42,860 and gone, "This is disgraceful!" 1043 00:50:42,860 --> 00:50:45,700 Well, you shouldn't have printed it, then. 1044 00:50:45,700 --> 00:50:47,460 OK, how about some good news? 1045 00:50:47,460 --> 00:50:48,740 Take a look. 1046 00:50:55,020 --> 00:50:56,820 When this man started his career, 1047 00:50:56,820 --> 00:50:58,260 his ideas were considered 1048 00:50:58,260 --> 00:51:01,500 even more avant-garde than the buildings he now inhabits. 1049 00:51:03,220 --> 00:51:06,620 Today, however, he's established a global reputation 1050 00:51:06,620 --> 00:51:09,820 as one of the world's leading neurobiologists. 1051 00:51:14,900 --> 00:51:19,820 And all because he discovered he could hear rats squeak. 1052 00:51:19,820 --> 00:51:21,940 RATS SQUEAK 1053 00:51:26,500 --> 00:51:30,380 You're hearing the squeaking through the ultrasound detector. 1054 00:51:30,380 --> 00:51:32,380 If we didn't have these detectors on, 1055 00:51:32,380 --> 00:51:34,260 you would not be hearing anything. 1056 00:51:35,900 --> 00:51:37,900 Once he'd heard the squeaks, 1057 00:51:37,900 --> 00:51:41,020 Panksepp was determined to discover what they might mean. 1058 00:51:42,660 --> 00:51:44,660 One morning I woke up and said, 1059 00:51:44,660 --> 00:51:46,500 "What if that is laughter? 1060 00:51:46,500 --> 00:51:51,060 And I said, "Well, then you should be able to tickle animals." 1061 00:51:51,060 --> 00:51:55,220 And we tickled the first rat, and it chirped like crazy. 1062 00:51:55,220 --> 00:51:56,540 The second rat... 1063 00:51:56,540 --> 00:51:57,860 As a matter of fact, 1064 00:51:57,860 --> 00:52:03,580 every rat except some really neurotic ones have chirped. 1065 00:52:08,540 --> 00:52:09,940 To the casual observer, 1066 00:52:09,940 --> 00:52:12,220 it might look like the rats aren't laughing at all, 1067 00:52:12,220 --> 00:52:14,620 that their tiny chirps are in fact cries for help. 1068 00:52:19,180 --> 00:52:21,540 But not only are the vocalisations identical 1069 00:52:21,540 --> 00:52:23,340 to the noises made in play, 1070 00:52:23,340 --> 00:52:25,420 the rats' behaviour tells its own story. 1071 00:52:28,660 --> 00:52:30,380 They are following my hand 1072 00:52:30,380 --> 00:52:33,820 because it's a hand that has brought them great joy. 1073 00:52:33,820 --> 00:52:35,740 HE CHUCKLES 1074 00:52:35,740 --> 00:52:37,500 Oh, he just bit me. 1075 00:52:37,500 --> 00:52:40,660 HE LAUGHS But he didn't hurt me. 1076 00:52:40,660 --> 00:52:44,260 So that's their way of indicating, "Come on, let's play." Ooh! 1077 00:52:44,260 --> 00:52:47,020 I love rats. HE LAUGHS 1078 00:52:47,020 --> 00:52:51,060 They're such fun animals, so smart and so emotional. 1079 00:52:52,500 --> 00:52:57,900 As far as we can tell, we've got the same basic emotions as rats. 1080 00:53:01,340 --> 00:53:04,820 But Panksepp's idea, that rats have emotions, 1081 00:53:04,820 --> 00:53:07,060 did little to endear him to his colleagues. 1082 00:53:08,620 --> 00:53:11,700 People say you've been giving human qualities to animals - 1083 00:53:11,700 --> 00:53:13,140 anthropomorphism - 1084 00:53:13,140 --> 00:53:16,740 and I tell them I have not been doing anything of the sort. 1085 00:53:16,740 --> 00:53:18,820 I am doing zoomorphism. 1086 00:53:18,820 --> 00:53:21,900 I am trying to understand the animal mind 1087 00:53:21,900 --> 00:53:25,300 as a way to illuminate the human mind. 1088 00:53:27,540 --> 00:53:30,300 The critics argue that our complex brains are so different 1089 00:53:30,300 --> 00:53:33,500 to rats' brains that any comparison is meaningless. 1090 00:53:35,060 --> 00:53:40,380 But the reality is emotions occur in the evolutionary ancient brain, 1091 00:53:40,380 --> 00:53:43,180 the part we share with all mammals, including rats. 1092 00:53:44,660 --> 00:53:48,460 And we know that animals that have been bred for high laughter 1093 00:53:48,460 --> 00:53:50,940 are resistant to depression. 1094 00:53:50,940 --> 00:53:53,980 That means they have chemistries that protect them 1095 00:53:53,980 --> 00:53:56,100 against the vicissitudes of life. 1096 00:53:57,300 --> 00:54:00,540 Animals that have been bred for lower laughter 1097 00:54:00,540 --> 00:54:02,500 are susceptible to depression. 1098 00:54:05,540 --> 00:54:08,820 If we understand animal emotional processes 1099 00:54:08,820 --> 00:54:11,540 at the fundamental instinctual level, 1100 00:54:11,540 --> 00:54:15,700 I think we will have a science of human basic emotions, 1101 00:54:15,700 --> 00:54:19,140 and that's very valuable for understanding ourselves 1102 00:54:19,140 --> 00:54:22,620 and having a more sophisticated biological psychiatry. 1103 00:54:24,340 --> 00:54:27,500 Panksepp's idea was to use the rats' laughter to identify 1104 00:54:27,500 --> 00:54:31,660 the precise area in the ancient brain involved in happiness, 1105 00:54:31,660 --> 00:54:35,380 and in so doing to identify the neurochemistry responsible. 1106 00:54:37,260 --> 00:54:40,900 Using that approach, a group from Northwestern University in Chicago 1107 00:54:40,900 --> 00:54:43,420 identified a happiness neurotransmitter. 1108 00:54:43,420 --> 00:54:45,740 They call it GLX-13. 1109 00:54:45,740 --> 00:54:47,100 Catchy. 1110 00:54:47,100 --> 00:54:50,860 And they've also developed a drug to stimulate its production. 1111 00:54:50,860 --> 00:54:54,700 In 2013, they started human clinical trials. 1112 00:54:54,700 --> 00:54:56,540 The results were so impressive, 1113 00:54:56,540 --> 00:55:02,420 that two years later it was bought by a drugs company for $560 million. 1114 00:55:03,860 --> 00:55:05,460 Surprising as it is, 1115 00:55:05,460 --> 00:55:09,540 £560 million is not bad for buying the rights 1116 00:55:09,540 --> 00:55:12,580 to the most powerful item on the horizon. 1117 00:55:16,260 --> 00:55:18,620 It's a new way of treating depression - 1118 00:55:18,620 --> 00:55:21,540 an antidepressant that, instead of reducing sadness, 1119 00:55:21,540 --> 00:55:23,700 promotes happiness. 1120 00:55:23,700 --> 00:55:26,220 It's an approach that shows great promise, 1121 00:55:26,220 --> 00:55:28,660 and all this from tickling rats. 1122 00:55:30,060 --> 00:55:35,740 Rat laughter forces you to think about the molecules of social joy, 1123 00:55:35,740 --> 00:55:42,820 so, you know, I am pleased and surprised in retrospect 1124 00:55:42,820 --> 00:55:45,380 that we got that far. 1125 00:55:45,380 --> 00:55:49,740 And, you know, it's one of the wonderful things of science - 1126 00:55:49,740 --> 00:55:51,580 there's always surprises. 1127 00:55:57,860 --> 00:55:59,100 So, that's me out of a job. 1128 00:55:59,100 --> 00:56:01,740 Comedy in pill form - I suppose it had to happen sometime. 1129 00:56:01,740 --> 00:56:03,660 We had a good run. LAUGHTER 1130 00:56:03,660 --> 00:56:05,420 So, back to our questions - what is laughter? 1131 00:56:05,420 --> 00:56:08,140 Why do we laugh? And what has it got to do with comedy? 1132 00:56:08,140 --> 00:56:10,060 I think we've answered it, haven't we? Yeah. 1133 00:56:10,060 --> 00:56:11,900 Laughter's a social emotion. 1134 00:56:11,900 --> 00:56:14,060 Social activity, 1135 00:56:14,060 --> 00:56:16,780 pre-language vocalisation. 1136 00:56:16,780 --> 00:56:18,780 OK. Why do we laugh? 1137 00:56:18,780 --> 00:56:23,260 Originally it really is designed to allow us to bond with each other, 1138 00:56:23,260 --> 00:56:25,860 but actually the endorphins that trigger out 1139 00:56:25,860 --> 00:56:27,620 in effect tune the immune system. 1140 00:56:27,620 --> 00:56:29,980 So they actually do make you healthier. 1141 00:56:29,980 --> 00:56:31,380 But it's very ancient, it is, 1142 00:56:31,380 --> 00:56:32,820 I mean, it predates language 1143 00:56:32,820 --> 00:56:36,060 probably by about a million and a half years, I would say. 1144 00:56:36,060 --> 00:56:38,500 Wow. OK. And what's it got to do with comedy? 1145 00:56:38,500 --> 00:56:40,940 Well, comedy fundamentally is about pointing out 1146 00:56:40,940 --> 00:56:42,220 what's wrong with the world 1147 00:56:42,220 --> 00:56:45,220 and doing it in a way that is acceptable to the audience, 1148 00:56:45,220 --> 00:56:48,940 so creating benign violations and delighting others. 1149 00:56:48,940 --> 00:56:51,460 Here's a question for all three of you. 1150 00:56:51,460 --> 00:56:55,540 Could it be said that laughter makes us human? 1151 00:56:55,540 --> 00:56:56,660 No. 1152 00:56:56,660 --> 00:56:59,020 I would say so. I don't think so. 1153 00:56:59,020 --> 00:57:01,060 It's just too... OK, so Robin's my favourite. 1154 00:57:01,060 --> 00:57:03,500 LAUGHTER I get the free tickets to his shows. 1155 00:57:03,500 --> 00:57:05,980 I'd like to thank Robin and the other two guests... Meh. 1156 00:57:05,980 --> 00:57:07,340 So, you think it...? 1157 00:57:07,340 --> 00:57:12,820 Well, in the sense that it does mark a key boundary point 1158 00:57:12,820 --> 00:57:15,260 from which everything else spins. 1159 00:57:15,260 --> 00:57:19,340 And of course the big thing about laughter is this breath control 1160 00:57:19,340 --> 00:57:22,180 and all this sort of control of the musculature, 1161 00:57:22,180 --> 00:57:24,980 the intercostal muscles in the chest wall, 1162 00:57:24,980 --> 00:57:27,620 and without that, language couldn't have evolved. 1163 00:57:27,620 --> 00:57:30,260 I mean, we've literally nailed this episode of Horizon. 1164 00:57:30,260 --> 00:57:32,300 LAUGHTER I'd like to thank our guests - 1165 00:57:32,300 --> 00:57:34,980 Sophie Scott, Robin Dunbar and Peter McGraw, 1166 00:57:34,980 --> 00:57:36,580 and thank you all for laughing. 1167 00:57:36,580 --> 00:57:38,940 APPLAUSE